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Games Mafia Game 107 - ACNH: The ManHel Tale - Game End

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Farfalla

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Aight, here are the game infos (setup and actions):
IDAffiliationPrimary RoleSecondary RoleSanityPlayer
1TownDetectiveInsaneMadNat
2TownSpySaneBrandish
3TownDoctorSaneAsako
4TownBansheeGB
5TownNecromancerShad
6TownPsychiatristBaka Taichou
7TownProstituteEvil3ye
8TownBulletproofLambu
9TownMorticiandigital
10TownPsychiatristHolt
11TownProsecutorLady Pompom
12Third PartySanta ClausKat
13Town/MafiaPirateTraitorJames Rye
13Town/MafiaNobleTraitorCrescent
15MafiaMafia DetectiveSirSamuel
16MafiaStrongmanGrySun
17MafiaMafia EscortCopy Panda
18MafiaPirateMarmalade
GIFTS LIST

❄ Brewster's Gift "Drink it hot or give it up." (Hot Potato)
The Hot Potato explodes at the end of a day designated by the host before the start of the game, killing the player holding it. The holder of the Hot Potato doesn't know when it will explode, but he can pass it to another player at night, separately from any night ability he has. This passing can't be blocked. If the holder gets killed, the Potato explodes killing both the holder and the killer; if the holder is lynched, the Potato [dies with him].
❄ Kicks' Gift "You never know how things might turn out." (single-use Bar Keeper redirect)
One player ends up being the drunkest and uses his night action on a random player.
❄ CJ's Gift "A night cruise is a good way to catch night fish." (single-use Mafia Detective)
The Mafia Detective has the ability to investigate one player per Night and learn the player's Role. Only he is told the role of his target via PM. Whenever the Mafia Detective's investigation ability is performed, he cannot be chosen to go for a kill on the same night.
❄ Wisp's Gift "Tah-Dahh!" (this player's votes are worded as "Ho ho ho" during the next day)

❄ Jingle's Gift "Isn't this the best time of the year, kid?" Mandatory 5th Gift
(Santa Clause: this gift allows the game to go on. At the end of the game, Santa wins with the other winning party. Happy celebration ;)



Now first lemme thank @Erinyes for her massive participation in the game. At first, I got the November slot to host alone, and she asked me to join and I'm so happy she did! She's not only a very curious and interested person so we had a very nice and easy time discussing our ideas, but she also has the strength and endurance of a lion... I was often dead while we were hosting, but Erinchi followed everything and kept the game organized. She barely slept @.@ And that's a testimony I really needed to share with you all, 'cause her dedication and calm deserve lots of appreciation.

Also thanks @Hardy and @Vandred for double-checking the game mech (and in Poop's case, the comp as well) and giving us your honest thoughts, so we could try to present a game that would be fair and entertaining to people.

And finally, even tho some other points were addressed already, I'd like to thank all the players, from the heart. I know this game was too soon because of my availability due to local holidays, and I know you guys were tired - which for sure didn't improve during this time lol. So I really need to commend you all, because you guys were either putting in a lot of time and effort inside the game, analyzing and discussing nonstop, or in the deadpad - you guys also got no rest. As hosts, that's the biggest kind of feedback we could get: to have you guys really onboard. Some moves were questionable, but no one can't say any of those teams weren't trying... it's only natural that drained people will make some mistakes, so to me that's another sign of the praise you guys deserve.

Quick comments about the game that I've mentioned in the deadpad already: in general, the idea with the mech was to add a simple new function (and we tried to map beforehand the main game new considerations we'd need to have it in place) but that could allow a new set of strategical moves to be exploited - now I would reconsider the priority we used since we realize it would have been more adherent to people's preference. The game also had 2 Traitors 'cause Pirate is a VERY weak mafia that can suicide and lose the ability to kill later on, so we wanted to give them better odds (lemme say it one more time in here that the notion that means town had 2 extra people to lynch is wrong, first because town had 2 killing tools in the Prosecutor and the Banshee, and second because they don't need to eliminate unrecruited traitors to win). It had 2 Psys 'cause even tho we wanted mafia to have better chances to recruit, that didn't mean we wanted them to recruit BOTH, so town had more chances to find at least one on the other hand (even if one role would get erased eventually), and at the same time the role could cause some confusion that mafia could exploit. The Mortician came in place to trace stuff like Santa and fake claims/transfers regarding any role/action that got "buried" - imo it's more effective than the SM because it can target antitown and spot unknown stuff that could still be in-game; it was a late game resource that had good chances of being effective with the role transfer mech. The Necromancer was also in there for its recycling capabilities since we'd have roles being lost, and in this setup it would be less OP than it usually is, since his options would still be reduced. The Santa was there for extra fun, imo, since the role could still be used even if the OG player and their wincon was gone: two gifts - that we expected to be the last ones - were clear signs that there was a Santa in-game in case it would fly by too successfully - and even that was just to cause some ruckus since the last gift allowed the game to go on after Santa would win - which to me it's a needed measure so we won't have sudden major frustration with an unexpected game end (I do understand why the game usually has to end when Santa is in it, so people don't ignore the role, but in this case we saw an opportunity to play around that and fix the issue regarding that); Santa's other gifts were there to provide some extra spice but unfortunately, as you can see in the night actions, I made a mistake while processing GB's action with the Hot Potato. GB got blocked by Evil when he tried to pass it to James and I overlooked it that the passing can't be blocked. It would have been simple to fix it during the day by PMing the both of them if Bran didn't spy on GB and, coincidentally, Sam hadn't claimed the exact same action and outcome. After discussing with some people, we reached the conclusion that the attitude that would cause the least interference and damage to a bigger number of players would be to just remove the Hot Potato from the game and inform that to GB, which is what we did.

GG mafia, you fought the long battle and won! GG town, it's never easy to be on the more clueless side, trying to put pieces together. GG Santa cause Santa is always fun~
 

Lambu

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Huh Im going to take a break and come back later to discuss more, keep it going guys!
 

James Rye

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Nah, I've done enough, time to relax and forget that Townie Lovers and Threesome are basically extra Third Player Bosses we have no way of finding by using our given roles.
 

GrySun

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Not if we got lovers this game and our Dets are too incompetent to find them because the townie lover will always appear as townie to them. <.<
It‘s been changed since forever that only the primary role matters for Det. Traitor likewise shows as innocent. Weren‘t you Traitor last game?
 

MadNat

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Not if we got lovers this game and our Dets are too incompetent to find them because the townie lover will always appear as townie to them. <.<
i am actually thankful for any advice in the next games until i am more knowledged, expierenced and can hint easier what is going on...although it might be offtopic...
 

Farfalla

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Hm, another thing I just noticed:
@Erinyes @Farfalla the rules say that the selection occurs in the phase following the kill, meaning we get told what role the killed had after N1 and then the dead player choses during D2 who to give it to? Meaning no roles are hidden which also means once Mafia killed someone they can sort of track the openly declared role if someone comes out that they received a role. But it also gives us information so that is better than a basic "Janitor" mechanic that hides all roles when killed/lynched. Just wanted to confirm it is that way.
After all basic game rules were followed and resulted in a N1 kill, the dead player can pick a target to send his role to during D2 - which will take immediate effect at the end of it.
 

Shad

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It‘s confusing because of how the „guessing“ works, but not dwelling on that much. Odd that you‘re this informed on how a mafia mechanic works this soon.
Gry now that the thread has slowed down, care you explain why you ignored my intention to vote you?

Also what do you think of James this game? Do you still stand by the accusation above?
 

GrySun

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Gry now that the thread has slowed down, care you explain why you ignored my intention to vote you?

Also what do you think of James this game? Do you still stand by the accusation above?
Because I actually expected you to lock me D1 long before I signed up :lmao So I‘m only surprised that you haven‘t yet.

I started to feel more fine with him until he did the whole Lover Det thing. If there‘s one thing I know about mafia James is that he always, and I mean always, talks a lot about past games. Been my James detection pattern since game 70-something. So not feeling good about James currently. Early active claim is not indicative of anything either since that‘s a great way for mafia to avoid losing their role to a town passing it to them.
 

Shad

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Because I actually expected you to lock me D1 long before I signed up :lmao So I‘m only surprised that you haven‘t yet.
You basically just confirmed yourself to be mafia to me, in the hope you can convince others it a revenge vote, let play that game.

DD, Copy Panda are people I would revenge vote if I was like that, I threatened DD to lock him as pay back for doing it 2 games in a row, and I'm not doing it, I was just bluffing, so no this has nothing to do with revenge since there is nothing you did you me that warrants revenge to begin with.

Did you claim active/passive yet?
 

GrySun

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You basically just confirmed yourself to be mafia to me, in the hope you can convince others it a revenge vote, let play that game.

DD, Copy Panda are people I would revenge vote if I was like that, I threatened DD to lock him as pay back for doing it 2 games in a row, and I'm not doing it, I was just bluffing, so no this has nothing to do with revenge since there is nothing you did you me that warrants revenge to begin with.

Did you claim active/passive yet?
You‘re actually pretending that you didn‘t talk in Discord about lynching me D1 and agreeing with others that said so :lmao I don‘t mind your revenge vote but at least man up and stick to it.

I claimed passive on page 1 I think.
 

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You‘re actually pretending that you didn‘t talk in Discord about lynching me D1 and agreeing with others that said so :lmao I don‘t mind your revenge vote but at least man up and stick to it.

I claimed passive on page 1 I think.
I would have never expected you to go down this defence road, it looks patethic but you are the better player and every time you do something I think is wrong I get proven wrong so let see where this leads you.

@votekill gry
 

Asako

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God damn, 6 pages already take it easy guys so i can actually catch up, i don't think it was that long that the game begun for six pages to form xD

Btw i demands to call me shino guys this game, only acceptable name
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

I just got to the page of pompom throwing her prosecutor action, mad respect at that

Going back to catching up
 

GrySun

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I would have never expected you to go down this defence road, it looks patethic but you are the better player and every time you do something I think is wrong I get proven wrong so let see where this leads you.

@votekill gry
What should I defend? You made no points, just seemingly agreeing with James and I already responded to James on why he‘s wrong. Say something new or elaborate on his or my points from our discussion from before if you want to actually argue something. This way it really looks as it is, that you‘re still mad.
 

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I think passing the role early on in the game is more beneficial for mafia maybe, if they have a couple vanillas. While town would do it better later on once a det/doc dies and you can still pass it on.
Can we wait on passing? It's not an action required to be done right away ?
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

James why are you talking about lovers
I worry about lovers late game lol, why talk about it now that's end game content unless you're mafia, then it's your team problem xD
 

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What should I defend? You made no points, just seemingly agreeing with James and I already responded to James on why he‘s wrong. Say something new or elaborate on his or my points from our discussion from before if you want to actually argue something. This way it really looks as it is, that you‘re still mad.
Lambu is persecuted.

James put pressure on Gry by pointing out that Gry was playing the confused card and being indecisive.

Gry argues back and attempts to counter attack by accusing James of knowing too much.

Gry tries to recover by understanding the mechanic and no longer being confused and indecisive.

Shad points out James put Gry on the back foot and that Gry wasn't expecting this much pressure so early while he was testing the water.

Gry ignores shad

Shad ask Gry why he was ignored and what he thinks now of James.

Gry couldn't accuse Shad of being mafia, couldn't go back or forward on James and was only left with the option to play the victime of a cross game conspiracy to kill him D1 since he won last game.


~
It D1, every game one of the top poster is mafia, lambu is persecuted, between you and James you look the most scum from behaviour, you claimed passive as well while James is active, with lambu being cleared possibility, he will end up tanking a night kill eventually, which you would use to justify why you are still alive.

Factoring in all these information which isn't much but it D1, i feel like my money is best bet on your teammates that aren't posting enough to draw attention on D1.
 

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God damn, 6 pages already take it easy guys so i can actually catch up, i don't think it was that long that the game begun for six pages to form xD

Btw i demands to call me shino guys this game, only acceptable name
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

I just got to the page of pompom throwing her prosecutor action, mad respect at that

Going back to catching up
Right, I work for a few hours and come back to this lmao 😂
 

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Can we wait on passing? It's not an action required to be done right away ?
It's not mandatory, you can choose to not transfer it. But, if you do it, you select the player you want to pass your role to, during the phase after your death.
 

James Rye

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It‘s been changed since forever that only the primary role matters for Det. Traitor likewise shows as innocent. Weren‘t you Traitor last game?
Even traitor is innocent? o.o
Jesus, even in the original card game the traitor appears as scum to the one who checks on him but here it ain't so? Jesus Christ on a pogo stick...
Also if Dets only checks primary roles with their investigations why doesn't it says so in the Det role? It still talks about allegiance and a Townie with Traitor as secondary ain't pro-town, that's for sure. The whole idea of a naive traitor was that similar to a Townie Miller he gonna confuse Dets with the result. Same with a Townie Lover or Threesome, their allegiance in the end is anti-town no matter how much pro-town their primary role is.
Anyway, that's it for this part, I gonna write my thoughts about that in the Role suggestion thread or the Rules thread but I'm clearly in Lambu's base that this is OP and broken. Having so many roles that appear innocent when they aren't should not be the case for a mafia game.

@Erinyes @Farfalla
Thanks for the pm As for my earlier GrySun Vote lynch, I suspect Mafia Escort. Mostly because a day 1 Mafia Escort lynch would be the best result for town ever as active townie roles would have less to worry about.

@Shad You also gotta write in thread what your role guess for your lynch target is if you want to prevent said role to be given back to surviving Mafias.
 

GrySun

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Lambu is persecuted.

James put pressure on Gry by pointing out that Gry was playing the confused card and being indecisive.

Gry argues back and attempts to counter attack by accusing James of knowing too much.

Gry tries to recover by understanding the mechanic and no longer being confused and indecisive.

Shad points out James put Gry on the back foot and that Gry wasn't expecting this much pressure so early while he was testing the water.

Gry ignores shad

Shad ask Gry why he was ignored and what he thinks now of James.

Gry couldn't accuse Shad of being mafia, couldn't go back or forward on James and was only left with the option to play the victime of a cross game conspiracy to kill him D1 since he won last game.


~
It D1, every game one of the top poster is mafia, lambu is persecuted, between you and James you look the most scum from behaviour, you claimed passive as well while James is active, with lambu being cleared possibility, he will end up tanking a night kill eventually, which you would use to justify why you are still alive.

Factoring in all these information which isn't much but it D1, i feel like my money is best bet on your teammates that aren't posting enough to draw attention on D1.
That‘s much better. I never agreed with Ust‘s top poster theory, and I‘m top poster regardless of role, but this does look more like a proper reason to vote me and not just last game feelings.

I really did just ignore you for the post sounding kinda petty and like annoyance-bait. All I can tell you is that you‘re wrong that James „put me on the back foot“. He voted me for disagreeing on mechanic and initial hinting doubts, and that was the end of it.

Why can’t I accuse you of being mafia? 🤔 More like there was nothing to go on with you except that you were looking salty. For the record I think your post here looks pretty inconsistent, I don‘t remember you mentioning top poster=mafia in any game before.

Your trust in James is pretty weird as well. A mafia with a good role is more likely to claim active to not lose the role to townies passing their roles.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

!votekill James Rye for now. Mafia Boss guess. Would explain some of the weird Lovers talk.
 
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