Discussion Ace was kind of weak?

[amidaru312]

In my opinion, Oda made Ace to be a bit weak in comparison to Marco and jozu, is that just me or......?

There was arabasta, where he wouldve easily bested Smoker like luffy did with the fishmen on fishman island,
the fight with BB was okay, but at marineford, i get that he was all worn out and then got agitated by akainu, but I felt like if he was stronger he could've done more....

I think Jozu is probably stronger than him, and marco most definitely.

Also, i feel like his fire fruit might have been amazing in the begining of the manga, but a few years later as the manga ran on, I think his fruit kinda worn out in awesomeness and we got all these other cool fruit and Oda was just stuck because he introduced ace so early so his fruit was just at a disadvantage? The alabasta arc was really just at the 100s chapter, which is basically about 2 years after the manga started, a bit too early?

Fire isnt really all that impressive once the manga got on, as we saw enel and the the admirals, y'know?

 

[jamarTheDem]

He was a beast against Blackbeard . It was just unfortunate that Oda design Blackbeard which such a OP Devil Fruit . Devil Fruit wise Ace showned WAY more mastery In his fruit then BB at the time .

He treated Smoker like a child . In fighting ability alone Ace was showned stronger then Smoker . Let's not forget Devil Fruit ability .

Ace was a death row inmate in Impel Down , clearly he wasn't feed rightfully . He was already defeated by BB . Those chains since being imprison was most likely Sea-Stones , so having them on so long clearly meant that he was very weak/weakened . Even after being freed he still was at the losing end .

I don't understand when his fruit lost it awesomeness ? Was it after we seen Akiuna (spell correct) ability , cause in my eyes even after Ace died he wa the first Logia to be introduced . His flame ability paved the rode for every others Logia , because if ace failed , crocodile/Enel/Blackbeard would fail too . His Devil fruit is awesome , especially in the anime . Fire is a common element in manga/anime character but clearly when Blackbeard vs Ace fight was shown Oda created new ways for fire to be used . The same thing he did for Caesar .

So in MY eyes Ace was a very strong character and if he was alive now he'd still be strong .

 

[Ryuzaki L]

He was a beast against Blackbeard. It was just unfortunate that Oda designed Blackbeard with such an OP Devil Fruit. Devil Fruit wise Ace shown WAY more mastery In his fruit than BB at the time.

He treated Smoker like a child. In fighting ability alone Ace was shown stronger than Smoker. Let's not forget Devil Fruit ability.

Ace was a death row inmate in Impel Down, clearly he wasn't feed rightfully. He was already defeated by BB. Those chains since being imprison were most likely Sea-Stones, so having them on so long clearly meant that he was very weak/weakened. Even after being freed he still was at the losing end .

I don't understand when his fruit lost its awesomeness? Was it after we seen Akainu (spell correct) ability, cause in my eyes even after Ace died he was the first Logia to be introduced. His flame ability paved the rode for every others Logia, because if ace failed, crocodile/Enel/Blackbeard would fail too. His Devil fruit is awesome, especially in the anime. Fire is a common element in manga/anime character but clearly when Blackbeard vs Ace fight was shown Oda created new ways for fire to be used. The same thing he did for Caesar.

So, in MY eyes Ace was a very strong character and if he was alive now he'd still be strong .

Actually, Smoker was the first Logia we've seen in the Manga.

 

[jamarTheDem]

Actually, Smoker was the first Logia we've seen in the Manga.

Lol Your Right It's Not Ace , It's Dragon

 

[Ryuzaki L]

Lol Your Right It's Not Ace , It's Dragon

 

[M3J]

In my opinion, Oda made Ace to be a bit weak in comparison to Marco and jozu, is that just me or......?

There was arabasta, where he wouldve easily bested Smoker like luffy did with the fishmen on fishman island,
the fight with BB was okay, but at marineford, i get that he was all worn out and then got agitated by akainu, but I felt like if he was stronger he could've done more....

Akainu said it best: magma is stronger than fire. Maybe Ace could have done more, but their goal was to run away, not continue fighting. Ace got fatally hit because he was protecting Luffy.

I think Jozu is probably stronger than him, and marco most definitely.

Also, i feel like his fire fruit might have been amazing in the begining of the manga, but a few years later as the manga ran on, I think his fruit kinda worn out in awesomeness and we got all these other cool fruit and Oda was just stuck because he introduced ace so early so his fruit was just at a disadvantage? The alabasta arc was really just at the 100s chapter, which is basically about 2 years after the manga started, a bit too early?

Fire isnt really all that impressive once the manga got on, as we saw enel and the the admirals, y'know?

Fire can be pretty powerful though. It's strong enough that the gladiators and fighters were competing in a tournament to win the fruit.

 

[jamarTheDem]

I said that because it's Dragon Powers that saved Luffy from buggy who was about to cut his neck and killing him . Lol right ?

 

[I Am Atomic]

I said that because it's Dragon Powers that saved Luffy from buggy who was about to cut his neck and killing him . Lol right ?

We don't know if dragon is a logia or even if he has a fruit.

 

[kkck]

Considering what we saw between ace and jinbe I would argue that ace was about as strong as luffy today. Which would of course put him beneath the likes of doflamingo, jozu and marco. Marco and jozu were pirates of fame and position greater than ace, they had reputation and power built over decades of pirating. Ace was not weak however the margin of strength that exist between people is still great. Just look at luffy, even if he does win against doflamingo, which will likely be the case, it is obvious doflamingo is well stronger. And doflamingo is not even something like a yonko or anything, he still holds less power than someone like that. I would argue that the situation with ace was that he was indeed world class strong but still was far from the strength he needed to be like a yonko o their first two fighters.

 

[Ricko]

Ace is no way weak, he just pay to have the worst matchup in all his fight !!!

- Against Smoker he didn't want to fight, he was just playing, and it would be anti-climatic if Smoker was stomped at this part of the series.

- Blackbeard even without his fruit his someone that Shank acknowleged his power !!! With his fruit there was no way Ace could win, he even give a good fight, BB said himself that Ace was terribly strong.

- Akainu... Even with the Gura gura no mi and a bunch of lvl6 Prisonner, BB (who beat Ace) run quickly away... This guy is a beast and his fruit stronger than Ace one....
Even Marco was only able to slow him.

Ace only seem weak because he didn't have the chance to stomp mid-tier fighter like Vice-admiral, or a have good fight with a better match up against a strong opponent.

 

[Madness20]

That Whitebeard wanted to make Ace the pirate king, tells a lot about Ace potential.
I just think Ace hadn't developed/trained his haki yet, because even without haki he was such an awesome fighter, relying a lot on his logia though. But anyway, even Blackbeard pirates praise is fighting abilities.

If WB thinks Ace is talented enough to be the pirate king, who would we be to doubt that?
Roger seemed a tad older than ace when supposedly started travelling around the grand line, and if roger was able to become pirate king, ace was probably even more capable.

 

[KingOfNight]

He was not weak at all, he just faced the worst possible opponents. Akainu and BB are two of the strongest characters in the series as well as the main antagonists.

He was still strong enough to clash with Aokiji like Marco and Jozu clashed with other Admirals. And was able to fight on par with BB who went on to become a Yonko. It seems to me that he's on the same level as Doflamingo and current Sabo.

 

[milek]

He wasnt weak at all. Blackbeard told his crew to not fight him because they dont stand a chance against him.

Ace protected Luffy , he gave his life for him.

I still think that Ace is stronger then Blackbeard but he lost just because he didnt know anything about his fruit.

 

[jamarTheDem]

We don't know if dragon is a logia or even if he has a fruit.

Theirs no proof that it wasn't a Logia or Devil Fruit ability he used either .

 

[amidaru312]

Theirs no proof that it wasn't a Logia or Devil Fruit ability he used either .

What kind of logia could it have been? He didn't turn into anything, he just got on top of smoker when it was raining.

 

[jamarTheDem]

The Lightning that struck the tower Luffy was captured on had to be a Devil Fruit . When Buggy was about to behead Luffy you could of seen the sparks stop Buggy sword . The toward was burned by friction (I guess) and collapsed when the screws magically was knot out . The lightning magically disappear and the rain cameback . Afterwards Dragon stopped Smoker again .

Dragon most likely have a storm or weather fruit . Even Smoker himself asked Dragon why he saved Luffy . It's pretty obvious .

 

[Muhbaer]

seems like ace was only able to use conquerer's haki in tough situations like luffy. marco and jozu were able to use Busoshoku Haki to hit the admirals.
if ace was able to be a squad leader without Busoshoku Haki then he must have been pretty strong. but then again maybe oda didn't show ace using haki and he in fact could use it.

who knows.

 

[ProGoddess]

Somehow I feel that I have not seen enough of Ace and his involvement in battles. Before I knew it, he had already been sentenced to Impel Down and the next thing that happened, he was going to be executed. Now, we have Sabo who has inherited Ace's devil fruit, Mera Mera no Mi. It is as if to show the continuation of "Ace" (in terms of the devil fruit per se).

 

[M3J]

We can conclude without a doubt though, that Ace was pretty strong without the fruit, and with it, he was on a whole different level. Blackbeard praised his fighting skills even without the fruit, and Ace despite the torture was able to fight after he was freed by Luffy. I think he's one of those very rare breeds of logia users who is still a high level fighter without his fruit, as one of Blackbeard's henchies commented. Not sure if this applies to paramecia as well though.

 

[Holt]

I don't think Ace was weak at all. If blackbeard's DF wasn't so over powered that it negates other DF powers, don't think he would have won. Also Ace being on WB's wing probably stifled his growth somewhat. He probably never even got to seriously fight since yonko are generally 'hands off'. Life and death fights bring out potential. You only need to look at luffy for proof. To top it off, it seems he couldn't even utilise haki in battle (speculation).