Hangout Black Clover Hangout Thread

[Franz]

Seems that we'll have a timeskip

 

[Undina]

Seems that we'll have a timeskip

Thank goodness he didn't grow any wider...but Lucius is still keeping things under wraps?! What'd he do to Damnatio, turn him into a puppet?

 

[Rikudou King]

I wouldn't be surprise if he has grown somewhat, he grew a bit during the previous timeskip. Lucious was playing the long game, not surprising he's still maintaining things. That said, it could easily be that Asta and co are being summoned by another power, like Loropechka.

 

[Undina]

That said, it could easily be that Asta and co are being summoned by another power, like Loropechka.

Yeah, but the question is, where have they been for a whole year? And did they not interract with the Clover officials ever since the Spade Invasion? I'd find it obvious that most of the captains went back to their squads and duties, but the BBs had been used before for "diplomatic" liaisons(when training in HQ and officially in exile). Yet Asta, Noelle, Secre, Mimosa, Yuno had been invited before for personal reports to "Julius", and a now more "active" Liebe(as an official familiar) should sense something, methinks. Did they(the BBs) stick around Spade, along with Yuno, to help rebuild and restabilise it, and Lucius allowed it cause he wants all these kingdoms anyway?
And what of the elves, don't they feel anything off in Clover? Doesn't Dryad? Still curious why Tabata went and exposed Damnatio along with his knowledge to Lucius, in the big game he's still as irrelevant, imho, as his uncle or whatever on the literal throne.

 

[Franz]

but the BBs had been used before for "diplomatic" liaisons(when training in HQ and officially in exile).

I would say that Asta's name will have been cleared by now as he saved the whole kingdom.

In the end, the only one interested in condemning him is Damnatio, who for all we know could be dead or out of the game.

It wouldn't surprise me if in the next chapter we saw a Black Bull actually recognized by everyone.

 

[Rikudou King]

Yeah, but the question is, where have they been for a whole year? And did they not interract with the Clover officials ever since the Spade Invasion? I'd find it obvious that most of the captains went back to their squads and duties, but the BBs had been used before for "diplomatic" liaisons(when training in HQ and officially in exile). Yet Asta, Noelle, Secre, Mimosa, Yuno had been invited before for personal reports to "Julius", and a now more "active" Liebe(as an official familiar) should sense something, methinks. Did they(the BBs) stick around Spade, along with Yuno, to help rebuild and restabilise it, and Lucius allowed it cause he wants all these kingdoms anyway?
And what of the elves, don't they feel anything off in Clover? Doesn't Dryad? Still curious why Tabata went and exposed Damnatio along with his knowledge to Lucius, in the big game he's still as irrelevant, imho, as his uncle or whatever on the literal throne.

They might not have been anywhere. Arguably they would have no reason for any interaction with Clover officials normally - most of their past interactions were due to specific circumstances, and aside from Julius, what official would want to bother with them? Sure, they should be seen in a better light now, but being seen as more heroic doesn't mean people who were sour on them, which seem to be most of the noble class, will suddenly want to get close to them. Ironically, the one person who would probably be the best at bridging the gap between the two, Julius, has the most reason to keep them divided and have the Black Bulls remain his own personal minions.

Don't know about that. Without knowing how their connection work, who knows if underworld power can be sensed like that. So far, Damnatio was the only one shown capable of sensing it when it's not being overtly used. And given their lack of involvement in the last arc, despite their suppose connection, I would be surprised if the elves were involved in this one.

 

[Inuhanyou123]

How long now till raws?

 

[Undina]

Sure, they should be seen in a better light now, but being seen as more heroic doesn't mean people who were sour on them, which seem to be most of the noble class, will suddenly want to get close to them. Ironically, the one person who would probably be the best at bridging the gap between the two, Julius, has the most reason to keep them divided and have the Black Bulls remain his own personal minions.

I meant the officials in the WK offices mainly, including Julius, As I've said before, Asta and the other teens have been summoned for personal reports and debriefings before, whenever involved in big events.

Starting from Asta demolishing the ancient demon, then leading into their actions in Spade, and Noelle's group's actions in HQ during Vanica's attack, I imagine they piled up quite the intel needing to go into the same type of records Damnatio perused, and then some prestige too, something that normally would be acknowledged during events like the Star Awarding Festival(which is a yearly event, IIRC)...but that still begs the question if their squad is still in exile, even after Asta and Liebe's BDH, and if the summons aren't coming a year too late to solve that issue
I don't expect you to answer these questions, they're mainly for Tabata and I hope he answers at least half of them in the upcoming chapter. Feel free to share your predictions, if you have, though, it's all we have till spoilers drop.

 

[Franz]

if their squad is still in exile,

But have they ever been? They came and went to Clover without any problem.

 

[Undina]

But have they ever been? They came and went to Clover without any problem.

I'll have to look up the trial chapter(s) again, there was something about disbanding the BBs that they barely averted, or something, once Yami and the rest jumped in...and they were only still shown interacting with Julius and other squads' representatives, especially after the Triad's attack(Dante and Zenon). Anyway, they were sort of cut off from other official missions, IIRC, besides proving Asta's credibility, that's why most of the BBs actually had time to spend on training and even go away for undetermined periods of time(Zora and Magna)...oh, wait,

Spoiler: from chapter 219

https://ww7.readblackclover.com/chapter/black-clover-chapter-219/

.
Sorry, there's something that won't allow me to post the actual image.
Towards the end, the mission Nozel and Fuego bring from Julius claims that the BBs are exiled and that during the exile they're supposed to investigate the movements of devils outside the kingdom.

--- Double Post Merged, Jul 27, 2022, Original Post Date: Jul 27, 2022 ---

LOL, they finally found him a shirt...and the summons are specifically for Asta( and Liebe? he's in familiar form on the shoulder), there's that panel of Asta walking into a hall/the throne room, and there's even the foster family from Hage present...they all look proud... they don't show who's waiting, Lucius most likely, though, as the captains stand on each side of the person Asta's facing.

 

[Rikudou King]

But when and how would this exile be seen? Asta runs quietly around the kingdom, the Black Bull comes and goes without problems.

It would have been reported, likely via newspaper, and then Asta did disappear for half a year to the Heart kingdom. And not really. At most, he was around the capital a few times, and we were shown the Black Bulls were hanging around the border after the first time skip.

I would have liked to know how he could have done it, but ok.

By order of execution. He obviously had the legal authority, thus the reason the magic knights had to play along with the trial.

And what consequences would all this have exactly?

Justifying his execution.

Again, have we seen it all?

No, since we haven't been shown the wider group of magic knights. But there's no reason to disbelieve it.

??????

But if William was not accused of anything .....

They know he stood by and allowed Patolli to plot the whole elven possession.

And yes, let's blame what has nothing to do with it and has no logical connection with what happened instead of blaming, say, the leader of the terrorist group that up to two weeks earlier terrorized the kingdom.

What could go wrong....

That was literally explained. Going after t5hose actually involved would mean arresting and possibly executing their own military forces, which at best would weaken them to external enemies. Instead, placing the blame on an outsider like Asta means they can keep said military forces and also hopefully bring peace between those who were possessed and those they attacked.

That is, antagonizing the most powerful knights in the kingdom went according to plan. Ok ....

They were far from the "most powerful", and even if they were, going against the kingdom would not have been a great look.

But why do you keep saying that Asta was sentenced and exiled when nothing like that happened?

But that lack of trust among MKs is nigh non-existent. Exactly because they were all involved in the conflict and the final part, with the send off for the souls happening outside the Shadow Palace, in the open. The scapegoat was something aristocracy as a whole needed, because they were the main targets, they'd been involved(involuntarily, courtesy of their ancestors) in this plot for centuries, and because the masses would turn on them and they'd get civil unrest if it were universally known that the possessed culprits were royals, nobles, fallen nobles and bastards of nobles(but nobles by bloodline anyway). The MKs were shown ready to fix their issues themselves and even William and the GD were purposefully left be exactly for the astounding number of aristocrats in their ranks. The GD were voluntarily going off on many more missions to atone. So the MKs' public image wasn't something that needed clearing with a scapegoat, it was the aristocrats' as a whole class needing to protect their status.

They were all involved in the conflict, but only a select few were involved in the situation with the devil and sending off the elven souls. The rest were seemingly stuck fighting until the end. The only thing everyone would be aware of is the belief that William was the one who saved them all. But the finer details would either be unknown, or in conflict with the fact that said allies try to kill them and destroyed quite a bit of the capital. And sure, there was also a political reason, but as far as we know, it wasn't that clear cut across the lines - The majority of magic knights are suppose to be nobility and upper class, so it probably wouldn't be the regular masses but fellow aristocracies. And according to Julius, fixing their issues was throwing it all on a scapegoat. Even with all the atonement William is going through, we're still told he was mistrusted despite seemingly appearing to have saved everyone, so don't think it would be much different down the line.

Rebecca and co live in Nairn/Nean, a village/town set in the Common Realm, much closer geographically to Hage than the capital, you can check on a map. So, yes, the mayhem was spread out and at least half the kingdom was witnessing it one way or another.

Right, but we're talking about changing one's mind after being saved, which would only apply to the target of the attack, the capital.

But, as I've also said, Damnatio's convenient disappearance could have been and probably was looked at by the remaining opponents as somehow caused by Asta himself, to get himself out of this predicament...and was likely used to keep the trial going, yet things changed so much off-page that Asta wasn't merely acquited, he was allowed back on track to becoming Wizard King, a direct competitor for power and authority to Augustus Kira, meaning that even if there were still "many naysayers", they were nowhere near many enough to make a difference or prevent Asta from achieving his dream, even.

True, but the fact that it took a year to overcome, so presumably that long to change enough minds, would suggest that Asta's actions weren't seen as the act of a savior at that time, at least by the members of parliament.

Yet they're so few they don't make a change in the process of utilising the new status-quo as productivelyas possible.

Because this involved physical proof, while the situation with Asta would mainly be word of mouth afterward. Words that can be countered by the "proof" of Asta's guilt. That's not even counting any prejudice that they may hold that could color their belief.

There have to be more people working on that, investigating even devil hosts...as he mentioned, they had a whole community of devil hosts held in for investigations and intel extraction, and the way he addressed his sources of information, he wasn't the one to particlarly spend time with the "prisoners" and question them...he just went to their HQ/wherever they be doing their business, and grabbed some reports pertinent to his research.

I meant more on the sensing part. I'm sure there are others investigating devils and their host, but so far Damnatio seems unique in actually sensing a devil. When the Black Bulls had to try and find a devil, they were limited to looking for curses, and considering the number of devil worshipers around Clover, I would be surprise if there was many such people with that ability.

 

[Undina]

Right, but we're talking about changing one's mind after being saved, which would only apply to the target of the attack, the capital.

The Demon made it almost to the Capital, right?! And it was heard and sensed all the way to Nairn, right?! It was a commoner from Nairn who made that observation, on a devil coming to the aid of the demon...a commoner who sensed the 2 different types of malefic power, was able to distinguish between them, although the battle was held almost outside the Capital. And Rebecca's stern response shut him down, I don't think Tabata would go and create almost a page of episodic characters(albeit his friends and supporters), managing to silence negative opinion with one or two straightforward sentences, just to fill in drafting space. It's meant to show that there are cases where Word of Mouth does matter. And then we have the Captains and high ranking MKs he's won over, I'm certain they can persuade just as well, since we've had this point made before: not everyone, even in the ranks of the MKs, has a strong spine and will of their own. Some are more malleable, vulnerable, and easier to bend by leading figures.

True, but the fact that it took a year to overcome, so presumably that long to change enough minds, would suggest that Asta's actions weren't seen as the act of a savior at that time, at least by the members of parliament.

Yeah, one of my sore spots with the time-skip, we needed to be shown the reasons of that gradual changing wave that allowed for a majority that absolved Asta to form in the midst of aristocracy and the Parliament ranks, but what I strongly believe is that the event was clearly witnessed by enough influential people to let it sink in as an act of salvation. Besides, for his reputation to build back towards balance and then further, to earn him the promotion, he'd have to have been allowed back in the kingdom often and for long enough to help out with the other, smaller skirmishes, that are happening even now.
It would've been helpful if Tabata had shown us some focused character somehow recording the event(if there's such a magical device, just like the communication ones) in one of the panels, or vigorously taking down notes, and then at least one narrative line explaining it was a well respected writer with the newspaper which had initially formed Asta's bad image...and that they made amends by exposing this event to the wider public. Or any other action to this similar effect.

 

[Franz]

It would have been reported, likely via newspaper, and then Asta did disappear for half a year to the Heart kingdom. And not really. At most, he was around the capital a few times, and we were shown the Black Bulls were hanging around the border after the first time skip.

I repeat, Asta runs quietly with Yami, and you can see him go smoothly to Clover, as well as the rest of the Black Bull, even when they returned for treatment ....

By order of execution. He obviously had the legal authority, thus the reason the magic knights had to play along with the trial.

I mean, and the other royals don't count for anything?

Justifying his execution.

Too bad there is no justification behind it.

They know he stood by and allowed Patolli to plot the whole elven possession.

But who knows? The captains, if they really want to keep it secret (which is ridiculous since in any story in a medieval fantasy setting William would be passable for life in prison, but ok) they can very well do it, on the contrary, Patry's faults certainly cannot be covered up.

Going after t5hose actually involved would mean arresting and possibly executing their own military forces,

But that's not true, in the end that the magic knights behaved like this because of a spell was a known thing, it was enough to simply blame who had cast the spell.

Instead, placing the blame on an outsider like Asta

Yeah, outsider.

He is just the flagship member of the second most awarded team, responsible for saving the kingdom multiple times, and friends with the most influential people in the kingdom,

But no, he is an outsider.

And in all this they have all forgotten about the terrorist group that until the day before was the main enemy of the kingdom, but ok.

They were far from the "most powerful", and even if they were, going against the kingdom would not have been a great look.

Yami, Fuegolon, Nozelle, Mereoleona, Yuno, the whole Black Bull .... do I forget anyone?



See above, how can he be and in exile if he comes and goes to Clover at will?

 

[XXGenesis]

So I recently binged watched Black Clover’s Anime & have caught up to the mangaI enjoy Black Clover a lot, in both its mediums. The series is much better than the reviews it got when it first came out….

As of the latest chapters we are now in the final arc. I start to ask my self some questions I thought would be answered that don’t seem they will be…. Realizing that they are a lot of Plot holes in the series. Just an honest critique not hate. Black Clover’s World Building as the w story free desires more to be known or fleshed out. Because it leaves too many unanswered questions….

1) Overall World Building & Origin story.

- Multiple Races…Where/What happened to the Dwarves??
- Devils….Not even the Elf’s knew about Devils?? Where is the knowledge collected from on them?? We just randomly gained humans characters who had contact with them…
-Knowledge on Forbidden magic/ It’s relation to another dimension etc
- Grimoire’s are only for Humans/Elf’s….Who/How/Why we’re they created to give them so much versatility with their magic..

What’s the difference between A Clover Grimoire’s & a Spade Grimoire…What would another kingdoms Special Grimoire look like??

Those kinda questions…I didn’t even get into the whole dual spirit thing. Etc etc

 

[Franz]

The spoiler of chapter 340 are out.

 

[Farfalla]

We got a new Mafia Game starting soonish!

If it's the first time listening about the game, PM @Lambu about questions you might have or ask them away in that thread above~

 

[Kiki]

Come join MangaHelpers' World Cup 2022 Pick 'em challenge before Sunday (11/20) and discuss the matches!

 

[Franz]

The spoiler for chapter 345 are out.

 

[Zu_Le]

Spoilers for 346 are out.

 

[Erinyes]

Black lover is transfered Weekly Shounen Jump to Shounen Jump Giga.



Tabatai's personal message regarding the transfer of Black Clover to Jump GIGA:

"Transferring to Jump GIGA!!! As the serialisation of Black Clover has been going on for a long time, the increasing demands of the schedule for a weekly serialisation has been clashing more and more with my own situation as a manga author. Therefore, I’ve been discussing this with the editorial department for a while, and this time we have decided to transfer the serialisation to GIGA. It’s a sudden move and it might have surprised the readers.​

I would like to apologise for not being able to finish the serialisation in Weekly Shonen Jump. However, with GIGA, I believe I can proceed with the climax of Black Clover in a more optimal condition, aligning with my personal situation as a writer! There are still quite a few stories I’d like to draw, that I must draw, so please look forward to them. I’ll do my best to bring Black Clover to a successful conclusion! While this may need a bit of your patience, I will definitely power up in the upcoming Winter issue of GIGA, so I would be grateful if you could keep an eye on Asta and everyone else’s future!​

Thank you very much for your continued suppoooooort!! "