Discussion Is Shanks Rogers equal?

[WILDCARD 1 7]

I've been seeing this one make the rounds every so often ever since Shanks retired useless kid (no I'm not going to stop lol) and thought I'd make a thread for this topic.

I personally don't think in that class same class as Roger, Prime Garp and Prime Whitebeard. Though I think he's right under their class.
That is for one reason and this reason might not make sense to some people.
Rivals and Shanks only had two rivals Mihawk and Blackbeard(yes I'll count him as one).
Roger had had three Whitebeard, Garp, and Rocks.
Is Rodger was sent to have clashed with Garp with the two near the killing each other multiple times. Whitebeard is continually acknowledging as Rogers rival. And well this next one might be a bit of a stretch things down mysterious this guy is according to Sengoku Rocks was Rogers enemy so it's fair to say they encountered each other a few times.

Now Shanks only has Mihawk his Whitebeard, and Blackbeard his Rock's. But no one to fill in for his Garp.
Yes I know this turned in thread about rivals. But I do believe that he's just the ranking below him.
Of course as this series has yet to finish and with new information coming out about Shanks possibly related to a Holy knight that could change.

Of course there are smaller things like Rogers more aggressive personality so more likely to get in fights then Shanks more pacifistic. But this is the biggest factor to me as rivals are what push you and make you stronger and if he had just one more rival then I think he would be.

Of course these are just my thoughts please say what you think down below and I will be posting a poll above. Keep in mind I'm only talking about fighting strength here.

 

[Demonspeed]

I have no doubt that Shanks is in the same class. It definitely looks like he had what it takes to become Roger's successor. Even Buggy thought so.

He has to be in their class at the very least.

 

[WILDCARD 1 7]

I have no doubt that Shanks is in the same class. It definitely looks like he had what it takes to become Roger's successor. Even Buggy thought so.

He has to be in their class at the very least.

Yeah I don't put too much credit in buggies opinion on this. And that was a good moment for Buggy
Tho I do thing Shanks can beat currently Garp.
I'd say Shanks is at Roger's chin with a possibility of him equally him by the end. Especially with the noticeable power creeps that have been going on.

Maybe I should have put this in Davy Back section oh well

 

[AldarionTelcontar]

Honestly? We don't know. The only things we have seen from Shanks so far are clashing with Oldbeard, stopping an Admiral, scaring a novice Admiral, and one-shotting Kidd.

None of which requires him to be equal to Roger... but none of these examples required him to go all-out either, so he could be Roger's equal. We just don't know.

 

[Zmsp]

Well, I'm not a big fan of powerlevels, but in terms of narrative, Oda clearly wants Shanks to be a tier above the rest of the piracy pack, considering Blackbeard struggled at least a little bit against Law, while Shanks destroyed both Kid and Killer in a single shot, and Wano painted them as guys that can take a punch. There's also the recycling of Divine Departure, so I would assume that yes, Oda wants to portray Shanks as the equivalent of what Rogers powerlevel was supposed to be.

 

[kkck]

Not sure. Generally I was inclined to believe roger and WB in their prime were ahead of the modern yonko. And out of the previos iteration of the yonko I would have thought kaido was the strongest, even if only a bit. Shanks definitely has the potential to match or surpass roger at least.

 

[hokageji]

There's no way to know for sure, we haven't seen enough of them in action. Shanks hasn't been interested in OP so far either. If they were equals, wouldn't Shanks be considered a pirate king? nevertheless, Whitebeard still grabs the near Roger equal, so until we see a statement on those lines, he's weaker.

 

[DeadlyBeast]

I'd say they are pretty much equal. I don't think a person can get any better with haki than Shanks has and I believe that's also what Roger accomplished. I think Roger & Shanks are the peak of what a human in One Piece can accomplish regarding power level (probs add prime Garp to that list). WB to me despite his strength was below Roger/Shanks in haki and despite having such an OP DF he couldn't surpass them.

Luffy will be the one to surpass them by achieving the same peak with haki but also having one of the most OP DF powers possible. I believe Oda is setting up the story so that Luffy defeating Shanks is a completion of the torch being passed down. It symbolically means Luffy has defeated Roger in a fight of power level and separately will have accomplished making it to Raftel and actually finishing Joyboys original mission that was too soon for Roger to do.

 

[korwinkrulpolski]

I'd say they're about equal in strength but Shanks is much more reserved, coolheaded, calculated. And this craziness of Roger's make him stronger, more valiant, brave and much more dangerous in battle. In other words - Roger takes much more risks. There's no way he would sit on his ass for 20 years like Shanks just waiting to make his move.

 

[_goshi]

I've always considered him a sort of "sleeping tiger" version of Roger. The symbolic passing of the straw hat cannot be a mere coincidence, and I'm convinced we'll learn more about why Roger deemed him a worthy successor by giving him the hat - and not anyone else. Be it because he saw him as powerful enough to be a bridge to the new generation and see to Joy Boy's prophecy being fulfilled or because he thought he could claim the one piece himself remains to be seen.

If not in the same class as Roger, I still have trouble seeing him as less powerful than Rayleigh in his prime.

 

[DeadlyBeast]

There's no way he would sit on his ass for 20 years like Shanks just waiting to make his move.

He would if he already knew what was awaited him at Raftel. Shanks isn't waiting due to lack of ambition but because the time isn't right nor is he the right person for One Piece (and neither was Roger).

 

[grey matter]

Shanks = 1 arm Roger.

The narrative of losing arm making a bet for the future is also narrative supporting this. Shanks, someone who could have been the next pirate King, gave it away so that Luffy can become it and gave away his hat that he inherited from Roger (passing of the will).

So yeah, Shanks is comparable, but weaker due to losing one arm

 

[Demonspeed]

It looks like Shanks could have become PK but was waiting for something. Which reminds me of what Roger said in a flashback, that they were too early or something. Shanks probably didn't feel the need to tryhard before that.

Shanks = 1 arm Roger.

The narrative of losing arm making a bet for the future is also narrative supporting this. Shanks, someone who could have been the next pirate King, gave it away so that Luffy can become it and gave away his hat that he inherited from Roger (passing of the will).

So yeah, Shanks is comparable, but weaker due to losing one arm

Didn't Oda confirm that Shanks didn't get weaker despite the arm loss?

 

[grey matter]

It looks like Shanks could have become PK but was waiting for something. Which reminds me of what Roger said in a flashback, that they were too early or something. Shanks probably didn't feel the need to tryhard before that.



Didn't Oda confirm that Shanks didn't get weaker despite the arm loss?

I don't know about that, but seems like he did.

Whitebeard mentioned about it, Mihawk refuses to duel him etc.
And logically it makes sense as well. He lost his main hand. And two handed swing > 1 handed swing.

 

[Grimzilla32]

"Useless Kidd", now that's funny. We all thought he was going to be the "Whitebeard" to Luffy's "Gold Roger", but instead he's the "Gecko Moria" of the worse generation but with more success

But to throw my straw hat into the debate; Shanks is either at Roger's level or he is as close to that level as anyone can get, like right under "Pirate King" level.

I say that because to build hype for the story, especially with who's left on the board, SOMEONE needs to be at that level and all signs to Shanks being that guy. That and let's be fair, there's so much hype behind Shanks that he has to be there but, like Whitebeard, wilfully doesn't take the throne because he wants another to take it.

That all being said, I imagine at some point, this question will be definitively answered by Oda bfore the end. Like they'll have been something Roger did in the past (an attack or the amount damage done to something) and Shanks will perfectly replicate it in front of Luffy to show him THIS is what it means to be "Pirate King" level.

 

[TitaniumOxide]

In before it is revealed that Shanks is not Roger's equal but actually his twin brother from the Holy Knights. Now that would cause chaos here in the forums for sure if true!

 

[DeadlyBeast]

I don't know about that, but seems like he did.

Whitebeard mentioned about it, Mihawk refuses to duel him etc.
And logically it makes sense as well. He lost his main hand. And two handed swing > 1 handed swing.

I don't think Oda actually ever said that, at least not in any SBS I could find. There was a databbook entry though that said he's still powerful despite having only one arm.

However, one thing we do have to keep in mind is that handicaps (at least ones in real life) don't really mean much in the manga. If we are to argue that Shanks is weaker due to loss of his arm we also would have to argue that Roger was weaker because he was sick with a terminal illness. I think Oda will ignore these and make the characters as strong as he feels like making them.

On your comment about passing the Strawhat. With the recent reveals my thoughts are:

• Shanks knows about Raftel and likely learned from other RP members like Rayleigh that it was too soon and that they'd have to wait for some certain time
• Shanks likely learned about the Joyboy figure and how someone carrying his will would be the one to finish what he started 800 years ago
• We now know from multiple sources that the old DF book doesn't have Gomu Gomu fruit in it so guessing Shanks might have known its real identity
• Shanks stole the Gomu Gomu from Marines with the intent of making sure he ushered in the next Joyboy (whether he thought he could be it himself like Kaido or not is unclear)
• Shanks randomly met Luffy and out of pure coincidence Luffy eats the fruit, is a D, related to some of strongest fighters in the verse, and has the same values/dreams as Roger/old Joyboy.

I think it was after all the above that Shanks decided to wager his arm and end up giving the Strawhat to Luffy. I think Shanks truly believed Luffy will be the one that completes what Joyboy started & Roger re-ignited.

And for Luffy Shanks and his crew are the ultimate challenge that he feels he must overcome to prove that he is ready for taking on the mantle. To me this is very plot significant in the same way Zoro surpassing Mihawk is plot significant. And based on what we have recently seen Shanks do - incredible haki (better than any we've seen), using same sword technique as Roger, easily wiping out Kidd & crew etc, Oda likely will use him to be modern Roger level righter for the plot. It may not yet make sense from a power leveling point of view but it does make narrative sense for the passing of the torch. In the same vein I do also think BB will be Rocks level due to narrative even if he hasn't really shown us that kind of power yet.

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

Shanks is not Roger's equal.
Whitebeard was alive and was said to be the strongest pirate in the world.
No one could become Pirate King because Whitebeard was alive... not Kaido, not Big Mom and not Shanks.

Joker said this himself, he said now that Whitebeard is out of the picture is the only reason anyone can now challenge for the throne.
Roger was equal to Whitebeard if not actually being superior to Whitebeard.

With that said, given that Shanks was never stated as closest to the One Piece or equal to Whitebeard, he's definitely not on Roger's level. Roger and Whitebeard were a cut above the rest. Akainu has pretty much said this, Joker has said this and even Crocodile said Roger and Whitebeard were the reason no one else could be Pirate King as did Chinjao.

We seem to conflate the most recent coolest scene as evidence x character is the strongest.
First it was Luffy's Gear 5th attack against Kaido, then Shanks' attack against Kid, then Garp's punch, then Koby's attack.

There will always be another cool scene, but just because a attack scene is cool or big doesn't mean they're as strong as Roger or Whitebeard who have been stated as the strongest.
Cool scene doesn't mean strongest character, otherwise by that reasoning, Koby's currently as strong as Whitebeard or Roger.

 

[AldarionTelcontar]

Shanks is not Roger's equal.
Whitebeard was alive and was said to be the strongest pirate in the world.
No one could become Pirate King because Whitebeard was alive... not Kaido, not Big Mom and not Shanks.

Joker said this himself, he said now that Whitebeard is out of the picture is the only reason anyone can now challenge for the throne.
Roger was equal to Whitebeard if not actually being superior to Whitebeard.

With that said, given that Shanks was never stated as closest to the One Piece or equal to Whitebeard, he's definitely not on Roger's level. Roger and Whitebeard were a cut above the rest. Akainu has pretty much said this, Joker has said this and even Crocodile said Roger and Whitebeard were the reason no one else could be Pirate King as did Chinjao.

We seem to conflate the most recent coolest scene as evidence x character is the strongest.
First it was Luffy's Gear 5th attack against Kaido, then Shanks' attack against Kid, then Garp's punch, then Koby's attack.

There will always be another cool scene, but just because a attack scene is cool or big doesn't mean they're as strong as Roger or Whitebeard who have been stated as the strongest.
Cool scene doesn't mean strongest character, otherwise by that reasoning, Koby's currently as strong as Whitebeard or Roger.

I think the idea of Shanks being Roger's equal came less due to a "cool scene" and more because of what he did in that cool scene... namely, he used "Divine Departure", an attack that we first saw used by Roger himself. So there is definitely some kind of a parallel being drawn there. I just don't think that parallel = Shanks' as Roger's equal.

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

I think the idea of Shanks being Roger's equal came less due to a "cool scene" and more because of what he did in that cool scene... namely, he used "Divine Departure", an attack that we first saw used by Roger himself. So there is definitely some kind of a parallel being drawn there. I just don't think that parallel = Shanks' as Roger's equal.

I disagree.

It's like saying that because Sabo used Fire Fist similar to Ace, that Ace and Sabo are equally as strong as the other.
I could very well say that since Lucci used Soru like Koby, that Lucci is as strong as Koby. OR Who's who is as strong as Koby.
2 people using the same technique proves nothing other than they can use the same technique, not that they're equals.

There's only few ways to prove Shanks is Roger's equal:

1. Actual statement from the series that states Shanks is equal to Roger or Whitebeard.
2. Statement that Shanks is the only Pirate since Whitebeard that can be Pirate King which has only ever been said about Whitebeard amongst Emperors.
3. Or, Shanks fighting Roger or an equal to a stalemate in a prolonged battle that's not just a clash or skirmish because almost any character can clash/skirmish with another.... Luffy clashed with Fujitora/Big Mom around the Dressrosa period for example despite being inferior to them.