Games Mafia Game #106 - Re: Starting a Witch Hunt from Zero - ENDGAME

[Lambu]

Here's the Player Alignment + Action List /

PLAYER LIST

1. @ShijimaTheSilentMan as Subaru Natsuki >>> Townie <<< Lynched DAY 4
2. @MArGi as Emilia >>> Townie <<< Lynched DAY 4
3. @Holt as Reinhard Van Astrea >>> Townie <<< Lynched DAY 1
4. @Brandish μ as Elsa Granhiert >>> Townie >>> Mason (third LUST Holder) <<< LOST
5. @Farfalla as Ram >>> Recruiting Mason (Threesome Candidate turned Lover)(SLOTH) <<< WINS!
6. Sky @Demonspeed as Rem >>> Townie (former PRIDE holder) <<< Killed NIGHT 4
7. @Tatsumaki as Beatrice >>> Mafia Member (former GLUTTONY holder) <<< Lynched DAY 6
8. @Lady pompom as Frederica Baumann >>> Mafia Mason <<< Lynched DAY 3
9. gnut @Copy Panda as Garfiel Tinzel >>> Mafia Member (Lover) (second GREED Holder) <<< WINS!
10. @Vandred as Roswaal L. Mathers >>> Troublemaker (ENVY) <<< LOST
11. @digitaldude as Otto Suwen >>> Townie <<< Lynched DAY 5
12. @Baka Taichou as Priscilla Barielle >>> Townie (former GREED Holder) <<< Killed NIGHT 2
13. @Evil3ye as Anastasia Hoshin >>> Mafia Member (former LUST Holder) <<< Daykilled DAY 3
14. @GrySun as Crusch Karsten >>> Sleeper (Lover)(SuperMason Recruited SuperMason) >>> Mafia Mason (Lover) (second PRIDE Holder)+(second WRATH Holder) <<< Recruited by both Parties on NIGHT 1 <<< WINS!
15. @MadNat as Ferris/Felix Argyle >>> Townie >>> Mason (former WRATH Holder) <<< Daykilled DAY 6
16. @James Rye as Wilhelm Van Astrea >>> Townie (Traitor) (second GLUTTONY Holder) <<< Lynched DAY 7
17. @Marmalade as Regulus Corneas >>> Townie Detective <<< Killed NIGHT 3
18. @Shad as Petelgeuse Romanée-Conti >>> Mafia Boss <<< Lynched DAY 2
19. @Erinyes as Sekhmet >>> Townie >>> Mason (second LUST Holder) <<< Daykilled DAY 5

​

DAY AND NIGHT ACTIONS

Spoiler: ACTION LIST

DAY 1

- Farfalla (Threesome Candidate) >>> Guesses GrySun and Vandred <<< Gets 1 Correct


- Holt (Townie) is LYNCHED


NIGHT 1

• - Tatsumaki (GLUTTONY Janitor 3/3) >>> Kill GrySun >>> Success! >>> P3 Coinflip vs Mason Recruiter (FAILS) >>> Kills AFTER Mason Recruitment >>> Turns GrySun into Mafia Mason
• - Evil3ye (LUST Escort 4/4)) >>> Block GrySun >>> Success!

• - Farfalla (Recruiter) (SLOTH Hider 4/4) >>> Recruits and Hides Behind GrySun >>> P3 Coinflip vs Mafia Kill (WINS) >>> Recruits First >>> Turns GrySun into Sleeper (Recruited SuperMason)
• - Baka Taichou (GREED Investigation 5/5) >>> Uses Psychiatrist on Farfalla >>> Success! >>> Knows Farfalla has a Secondary Role
• - Marmalade (Sane Detective) >>> Investigates Evil3ye >>> Success! >>> Gets Guilty
• - MadNat (WRATH Doctor 5/5) >>> Protect gnut/Panda >>> Success!

DAY 2

- Farfalla (Threesome Candidate) >>> Guesses GrySun and Herself <<< Gets 1 Correct


- Shad (Mafia Boss) is LYNCHED


NIGHT 2

• - Copy Panda >>> Kills Baka Taichou >>> Success! >>> Obtains GREED by the end of the Night.
• - Evil3ye (LUST Escort 3/4) >>> Block James Rye >>> Success!

• - Farfalla (Recruiter) (SLOTH Hider 3/4) >>> Recruits and Hides Behind MadNat >>> Success! >>> Turns MadNat into Mason
• - Baka Taichou (GREED Investigation 4/5) >>> No Action
• - Marmalade (Sane Detective) >>> Investigates Farfalla >>> Success! >>> Gets Innocent
• - MadNat (WRATH Doctor 4/5) >>> No Action

DAY 3

- Farfalla (Threesome Candidate) >>> Guesses GrySun and Copy Panda <<< Gets both correct and becomes Lover
- Demonspeed (PRIDE DTV) >>> Daykills Evil3ye >>> Success! >>> Obtains LUST and passes it to Erinyes


- Lady Pompom (Mafia Mason) is LYNCHED


NIGHT 3

• - Copy Panda (GREED M.Detective 2/2) >>> Investigate James Rye >>> Fails due to Block
• - GrySun >>> Kills Marmalade >>> Success!

• - Farfalla (Recruiter) (SLOTH Hider 2/4) >>> No Action
• - Marmalade (Sane Detective) >>> Investigates Tatsumaki >>> Success! >>> Gets Guilty <<< Dies tho ayyyy
• - MadNat (WRATH Doctor 4/5) >>> No Action
• - Erinyes (LUST Prostitute 4/4) >>> Blocks Copy Panda >>> Success!
• - Vandred (Troublemaker)(ENVY) >>> Urges Town to go Riot >>> Success! >>> Next Day will have Double Lynch

DAY 4 : - ShijimaTheSilentMan (Townie) and MArGi (Townie) are Both LYNCHED




NIGHT 4

• - Copy Panda (GREED Strongman 1/2) >>> Strongman-kills Demonspeed >>> Success! >>> Obtains PRIDE at the End of the Night and passes it to GrySun >>> GREED loses its effects and becomes Inert.

• - Farfalla (Recruiter) (SLOTH Hider 2/4) >>> Recruits Erinyes >>> Success! >>> Turns Erinyes into a Mason
• - MadNat (WRATH Doctor 4/5) >>> Protects Demonspeed >>> Fails <<< Strongman-kill bypasses it
• - Erinyes (LUST Prostitute 3/4) >>> Blocks James Rye >>> Success!

DAY 5

- MadNat (WRATH Police Officer 3/5) >>> Protect Farfalla from Daykills >>> Success!
- GrySun (PRIDE Assassin 2/2) >>> Assassinates Erinyes >>> Success! >>> Obtains LUST (2/4) and passes it to Brandish


- digitaldude (Townie) is LYNCHED


NIGHT 5

• - Farfalla (Recruiter) (SLOTH Hider 1/4) >>> Recruits Brandish >>> Success! >>> Turns Brandish into a Mason
• - MadNat (WRATH Doctor 2/5) >>> No Action
• - Brandish (LUST Prostitute 2/4) >>> No Action

DAY 6

- MadNat (WRATH Police Officer 2/5) >>> Protect Farfalla from Daykills >>> Success!
- GrySun (PRIDE Assassin 1/2) >>> Assassinates MadNat >>> Success! >>> PRIDE Witch Factor disappears >>> Obtains WRATH from his victim


- Tatsumaki (Mafia Member)(GLUTTONY) is LYNCHED >>> GLUTTONY Witch Factor goes to James Rye >>> Authority will activate by the End of the Night Phase.


NIGHT 6

• - GrySun (WRATH Sickly) >>> Infects Vandred >>> Success! >>> Vandred cannot vote next DayPhase
• - Brandish (LUST Prostitute 2/4) >>> Blocks Copy Panda >>> Success!

DAY 7

- James Rye (Townie)(Traitor)(GLUTTONY) is LYNCHED

- END OF THE GAME

 

[Demonspeed]

Say you have a mafia that is very trusted/confirmed, like a Boss cleared by a Det, how do you lynch him? At least the Mafia Lover would get lynched before the Boss is.

Hard to say because I am not in this situation and the settings change.

All I wanted to say is that when they are cooperating Lovers can probably manage.

 

[GrySun]

The "if not all" part is disproved by me x Gajeel's win just say "most".

Frankly I forgot the overall circumstances that game, which is why I didn‘t say „all“

@Hardy would surely have lots more to say on that one

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 2, 2022, Original Post Date: Nov 2, 2022 ---

All I wanted to say is that when they are cooperating Lovers can probably manage.

I agree with your overall notion, just that atm I can‘t think of a way I would manage it myself. Like I said, a big part for our win were the circumstances, so pulling it off without a lot of convenient happenings is probably quite difficult.

 

[Lambu]

Sorry for the wait, I needed a few days to disconnect off Mafia for a bit. Still for anyone thats still interested...

POST-GAME TALK! \/

Its been years since I started thinking about hosting this particular theme, since as most of you know Im a big fan of the Re:Zero Novels.
Its a really good series. I think many people here would enjoy it if they give it a chance, it only gets better and better. Despite not enjoying isekai genre as a whole, I find this series as the only work of that genre that I can see myself recommending to anyone.

Thinking back right now, its actually amazing that the game came to be as nicely as I wanted it to be, something that would not have been possible without @Crescent Jinx and @Asako , my dear hosts who had to put through with so much rambling, analysis, proof-reading and balance in the hosting pad (Im sorry for tagging you so many times girls, this birb just cant shut up), and that goes without mentioning the titanic effort required to host the actual thing.
They both were crucial to the planning, development and execution of this game so I want to thank them once again here, I cant wait to host another game with you in the future.

I also want to give my wholehearted thanks to @Valhalla for designing and making the outstanding avis that we had the honor to use. Each Avatar having a different background according to the character, the excelent lining effect, making the most out of the low quality images I provided and many others he brought himself, he did a job several leagues beyond anything I could hope to achieve myself.
Im going to keep this Echidna avi for a long while not just cause its gorgeous, but the memory aswell.

Witch Factor Mechanic
​

Over a year ago, Cres and I talked about which type of mechanic we could implement. At that time people were making huge mechanics that enforced guessing parallel movements over playing the trust and distrust game, the essence of Mafia Game.
For that reason, the original idea was creating a Vanilla Game with select custom superroles based on the 7 Sins with one purpose in mind:

Punishing role reveals hard​

We brainstormed the abilities that we would implement, taking inspiration from the series itself (Greed being related to knowledge, Wrath to defensive capabilities and so on) and after making a chart of interactions the idea for the set up was done.
The game would feature 7 active roles moving from allegiance to allegiance based on who gets killed, that way people in both factions would be wary of revealing themselves for credibility, as that would mean not just one allegiance losing an asset but the the enemy winning a new one.


The idea looked promising, but we had to bypass many problems related to Balance first: How it would pass from faction to faction, and How much would the passing effect the course of the game.
After long discussions we settled for something similar to the FMA game, making Town or Scum win favour by lynching players from the opposite allegiance, all while carefully preventing the system from breaking the game via mass confirming players.

After that we also decided on giving each Role a number of Uses.
This part of the mechanic was actually very interesting on paper since players usually throw their actions left and right to see if "Lady Luck knocks on the door".
Making the Roles limited would make players be more thoughtful about their own actions and plan them according to the circumstances. This was particularly true for Greed and its multiple roles having a moment for different scenarios or Wrath and Lust having the option of witholding them, to save those uses for when they can really mark a difference.

Maybe there were a little too many uses in the end for this set up though, so this strategic approach to role usage was not fully explored, but I believe many things could be taken from it and I was pleased with the test.


All Witch Factors were designed and distributed in a way that created a line-up of single Mafia vs Town vs Hidden moles in between both.


TOWN: Investigation (GREED) - Hiding/Trap (SLOTH) - Doctor (WRATH) - Jesus/Trap (ENVY) - DTV/kill buffer (PRIDE)

SCUM: Janitor (GLUTTONY) - Blocker (LUST)


Since Town would possess two traps, I saw most fitting that one of them should be for one of the aforementioned "Moles"

Scum would need to hunt Witch Factor Holders in order to unlock their full potential (Ignoring protections, double kills, Creating their own Trap role, etc).

Town on the other hand, would need to be careful about disclosing their roles and get rewarded by a Prostitute or a BP/Necromancer if they lynched the correct mafias. These would fill the defensive gap that the Doctor or the Investigators' death would leave.
The No-Disclosure approach would prove remarkably useful for the Jesus trap too, as it would not just give a Townie back but make one of the opponents a Burden that could turn the tides in the game <<< Ironically the only Factor that was not killed in the final game heh


Finally, as a side note, the mechanic also featured extra sins for a Mentor and a Starting Mentee, the most notable one being (VAINGLORY) which was designed around ignoring certain rules in the passing aspect of the mechanic + gifting Witch Factors to players according to their own personal interests.
Of course this would have only seen the light had the Player List reached numbers beyond 24 players, as in any smaller set up it would make things exceedingly complicated.

Game Structure and Balance of Factions
​

Taking into account the "heavy role" of the mechanic, the structure was pretty straightforward with a twist called Lovers.

With 20 players in mind: 12 vs 5 vs 3 (with 2 members in the scum factions being recruits, one for each) A rather classic arrangement.


12 TOWN: 1 Detective + 1 Troublemaker + 9 Regular Townies + 1 Freeman <<< Erased for Steven's drop out before the game.

3 IN BETWEEN: 1 Mason Recruiter (the TSC Mole) + 1 Sleeper Lover (with option of infiltrating the mafia) + 1 Townie Traitor (Real Recruitment for the Mafia)

5 MAFIA: 1 Mafia Boss (to infiltrate Town and lay low) + 1 Mafia Mason (to infiltrate the Mason group) + 2 Mafia Members (holding Factors) + Mafia Member (Lover mole)


After many simulations, the vast majority of them required Town to lynch incorrectly 4 times in order to lose the game. <<< As it happened in the real run.

The Structure was clear and simple with the exception of the Lovers ploy, which called back the idea of making a Mason that later becomes a Mafia Member, both ideas being already explored in Shirayuki-hime x Yona Game (Vandred: Sleeper SuperMason) and Omoneko Game (Vandred: Recruiting Mason Traitor) <<< Van being in the same position twice must be fate =>=

This made the Lovers the spice in a rather simple structure


Why the Recruiter Lover and the Sleeper SuperMason?

The reason was creating a solid entry point for the Lovers into the Mafia's schemes, and succesfully take over from them if they were to fall prematurely <<< which is exactly what happened

In my experience as Mafia Lover once, I observed that the reason Lovers dont usually get things done (or any TP role that isn't Mentor for instance) is because they are relegated to a situation of scavenging. They take the spoils of a shattered Mafia and somehow have to avoid dying by the hand of the remaining Towns, while having close to no decision on this outcome: Most times they are carried to that situation by the Mafia's misplays, not by their own ability.

So I tried to give a bit of twist to that notion by giving Lovers a boost on information and crowd control, while also having a stronger say on the Mafia's decisions and path for hunting Townies if recruited. This made them a proper force to take over the Mafia if they were to tumble and not simply fall with them or rely on Mafia "kingmaking" Lovers, as it happened a few times in the past.

This experimental approach to making Lovers a stronger strategical force who could take over the Mafia effectively if the latter destroyed itself too soon ended up being a success, which made me really happy as a designer. The back up plan worked, though of course the high quality players behind the final "conquest" was crucial, so hats off to them.


Why it wasn't unfair to Townies:

- The Recruiter would still follow its function of recruiting and confirming Townies, they would only have the liability of avoiding lynching their lovers if they happened to find them. Even after finding those lovers, hunting mafias would still be into their agenda, which brought an inevitable end to them too: By the endgame the Recruiter would have run out of hiding actions, making them a clear kill that no Mafia lover would be able to prevent unless they were the sole survivors.

- The Sleeper SuperMason was an extraordinarily strong Townie, having potential access to all pads in the game (as it happened in the real run). That was a double-edge blade as it would require a lot of attention and information control. Im pretty sure that if it hadn't happened to fall on the hands of a player like GrySun it would have made itself look odd and indecisive very quickly.

- Whats more, besides SuperMason being an Unasigned Secondary Role (meaning it can go to any faction as long as the main role is Townie) there was a major red flag around the way it was implemented.
There would be no more SuperMasons in the game, making it an unique case, and claiming that position would reveal a rather obvious truth about it:

SuperMason is used to prevent a Main Role from changing upon Mason recruitment.

That means the player would have to be holding a role worth not being lost for balance purposes.
Considering not even the Detective had that priviledge and there were already 3 confirmed trap roles in the mechanic, there were only two things that the Supermason could be: Miller or Sleeper.

This red flag would be the downfall of the Lover if it were to claim SuperMason as a way of winning trust. Regrettably so, not a single Townie caught this red flag in the actual game and instead chose to believe a regular player without actions being a SuperMason was very normal. C'est la vie... ¯\__/¯


Why it was't unfair to Mafia

- The Recruiter could be eliminated at all times by the start of the game since they had Escort Block power from the start. Later on they would most surely get access to Daykills by killing the claimed DTV, so the Recruiter's lifeline was actually small.
Theres no way any Lover would have been capable of preventing their Mafia from killing the Recruiter, literally impossible without revealing you are Lover yourself.
Only real option was if all Mafia members died early game... which is what happened again...

- The Sleeper (Lover) becoming mafia had its fair share of disadvantages. Losing its Townie Lover status meant being shown as Guilty in Detective investigations + the aforementioned mental drain of playing a triple agent at Nights.

Besides that, even if the Sleeper Lover was designed to be the "hardest" to suspect by its fellow mafias, there was still a Traitor waiting to be recruited, who would send a message more than once to try get their desired recruitment.
The moment it happened, the existence of a Lover would become obvious and it would take a simple rule of thumb to find the mole from there. Add that to the huge bullseye on the Recruiter's back and the Sleeper was done for.

As an extra for Mafias who dislike being betrayed by inside traitors I shall add this: Mafia is a game about Lies and Betrayal of trust.
If you are willing to lie and betray people in the main thread you must be ready to watch over your back at all times. In other words: Dont feel comfortable about tricking others if you are not willing to be tricked yourself, just saying.

On the Actual Game Development and Plays performed.​

I was quite impressed with players like @ShijimaTheSilentMan and @MadNat for their attention to the game. Its not easy to catch the flow of discussion and engage other players when you are green on certain interactions, so seeing them do their best to follow and understand what was going on was the best gift they could make to this birb host for its efforts.

@Evil3ye played an excellent game on both Day 2 and 3, making even some Townies switch attentions to Pompom and even believe he could have been a Death Miller for a long time after he fell.
Regrettably, he tried to bite way more than he could chew on Day 1 by going feral on Farfalla and Sakura and caught too much attention. Trying to become a Town Leader and failing will make you a certified Night Action target, as reflected by @Marmalade 's Night 1 choice (props to her for an excellent targetting choices till her death).

@Shad and @Lady pompom made the mistake of trying to save Evil when they were trying to go for a low profile, it ruined their covers completely.
I cant really criticize trying to save a teammate in need though, its a very human thing to do. I can only encourage them to reconsider their options in future similar scenarios. Also to take the chances at night and not experiment with risky plays without real substance (blocking Gry for instance changed their game completely, doomed it even).

@Tatsumaki was the best mafia for doing her best at not standing out, while showing her thoughts in game while making sense and staying consistent. Her only mistake was claiming having a Factor too early, which didnt stop her from fabricating a good claim even when she was statistically impossible to be Town and lynched DD. She was Town's executioner in a sense.

Boss @Vandred had really good insights all around, just like @Baka Taichou . Maybe the first one was a little too conservative at certain key moments (I know he was busy to play at full power) and the second too rash (easy kill after that Post 1 slip). Overall really solid Town performances regardless.

The rest of Town had good moments aswell, I was actually convinced they were going to win this by the End of Day 3 (Mafias were even wondering if the set up was Pro-Town ayyyy)

Unfortunately, and quoting the great salmon @Juviii , they started losing the North the moment they looked at Factors with more attention than they did to actual players.
They also failed to catch the hidden messages and hints that would have put them on the Lovers' trail, though maybe this happened because they didnt have a proper Town Leader to point it out (all of them were actually scum).

@James Rye tried so hard at getting killed that people believed he was pulling a Lawl and baiting with a Witch Factor He did a good job but paid the price of Mafia's fall from grace by not getting recruited in the end (ach so)

Best overall player was @GrySun with @Farfalla right behind, which makes their win well fought and most deserved. Sure they had a fair share of luck (coinflips, guessing correctly on Day 1, Mafias making themselves extremely easy to lynch) and blunders (claiming role/factor on Day 1, or mentioning Mafia Pad on the Mason's den)
It somehow worked out though and they kept their covers masterfully, tricking poor Tatsu and Nat for the entire course of the game. @Copy Panda played an excellent supporting role too while having so little time to participate properly, a Dream Team all around.

Besides that Night 2 Mason Pad with Farf and Gry learning they are both Lovers was my favourite moment as Host ever, I dont think that conversation can ever be surpassed in terms of fun and 200iq trickery


I hope this analysis shed some light on how we envisioned the game and why it came to be the way it was.
I'll repeat myself once more to say we are all very grateful for the dedication in playing, for thats what made the game truly memorable to us.

Thank you all

 

[Copy Panda]

omo

 

[Shad]

As an extra for Mafias who dislike being betrayed by inside traitors I shall add this: Mafia is a game about Lies and Betrayal of trust.
If you are willing to lie and betray people in the main thread you must be ready to watch over your back at all times. In other words: Dont feel comfortable about tricking others if you are not willing to be tricked yourself, just saying.

I cant really criticize trying to save a teammate in need though, its a very human thing to do.

I really wasn't playing on D1, really woke up 15 minutes before game end with 10 pages to read with a hangover, really wouldn't vote like this if I wasn't brain dead, this explanation didn't work with town, but even after the game still doesn't work xD

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 4, 2022, Original Post Date: Nov 4, 2022 ---

What I learned is next time there is a boss in a mafia pad, will let everybody chip in with their opinions and then just do what I feel is right.

Lover can't be boss or boss/ lover is the next lover power up, either way advice to everybody, you get boss use it, mafia isn't a team.

 

[GrySun]

What I learned is next time there is a boss in a mafia pad, will let everybody chip in with their opinions and then just do what I feel is right.

Lover can't be boss or boss/ lover is the next lover power up, either way advice to everybody, you get boss use it, mafia isn't a team.

No, mafia is a team. But more like a Dota team. Someone needs to feed create space. If you go in 1 by 1 like that, whole team dies as shown

 

[Shad]

No, mafia is a team. But more like a Dota team. Someone needs to feed create space. If you go in 1 by 1 like that, whole team dies as shown

lol I appreciate the Dota metaphor xD

I'm not saying mafia did well this game, I'm talking about the scenario in which mafia didn't fountain dive xD

In this game the only partial counter mafia had to this lover shenanigans was the boss, assuming the boss didn't feed, the boss should play as a solo player.

To the point of sending actions in private PM to the hosts to bypass the lovers using the mafia action information to their advantage.

And pointing out that currently if you see that your team has a mafia boss then there is a big chance your team also has a lover.

And pointing out the absurdity of it all, lover was supposed to add a bit of spice, not be mafia worse enemy to the point the only way left to play mafia is to go solo all the time.

Let see how fun it gonna be for the remaining mafia when they won't even know who they blocked / killed until they receive a PM from hosts because the boss is following the only strategy that works against lovers.

 

[GrySun]

lol I appreciate the Dota metaphor xD

I'm not saying mafia did well this game, I'm talking about the scenario in which mafia didn't fountain dive xD

In this game the only partial counter mafia had to this lover shenanigans was the boss, assuming the boss didn't feed, the boss should play as a solo player.

To the point of sending actions in private PM to the hosts to bypass the lovers using the mafia action information to their advantage.

And pointing out that currently if you see that your team has a mafia boss then there is a big chance your team also has a lover.

And pointing out the absurdity of it all, lover was supposed to add a bit of spice, not be mafia worse enemy to the point the only way left to play mafia is to go solo all the time.

Let see how fun it gonna be for the remaining mafia when they won't even know who they blocked / killed until they receive a PM from hosts because the boss is following the only strategy that works against lovers.

You don‘t really need a counter for Lovers though. If you do well eventually you will kill the town lover by lynch or kill, or even the threesome(which would indicate there‘s Lovers). So it just requires some more farming before you take Rosh, so to speak.

 

[Shad]

The recruiter was only killable as part of a double kill, which is something the mafia lover wasn't gonna let happen, the recruiter is also lynch immune.

So no the threesome candidate was protected from kills, the only way to discover this ploy was to fail a kill on them and question the misleading information provided by mafia lover, meanwhile the lovers are lynching exposed mafia and reducing their numbers.

The actual town lover was also immune to night killing and lynching, mainly because of their luck to be recruited N1, but luck or no luck the hosts intentions are clear, once recruited, mafia can no longer kill them and even if town lynches them, it still hurts mafia since they wasted a night kill.

The mafia lover was the only lover weak point since they are lynchable but at the costs of mafia losing a member.

You don't see how this lover was buffed at the expense of mafia? Hosts were very deligent to make sure town needed 4 misslynches for town to lose, so every buff lovers received was the expense of mafia.

 

[GrySun]

The recruiter was only killable as part of a double kill, which is something the mafia lover wasn't gonna let happen, the recruiter is also lynch immune.

So no the threesome candidate was protected from kills, the only way to discover this ploy was to fail a kill on them and question the misleading information provided by mafia lover, meanwhile the lovers are lynching exposed mafia and reducing their numbers.

The actual town lover was also immune to night killing and lynching, mainly because of their luck to be recruited N1, but luck or no luck the hosts intentions are clear, once recruited, mafia can no longer kill them and even if town lynches them, it still hurts mafia since they wasted a night kill.

The mafia lover was the only lover weak point since they are lynchable but at the costs of mafia losing a member.

You don't see how this lover was buffed at the expense of mafia? Hosts were very deligent to make sure town needed 4 misslynches for town to lose, so every buff lovers received was the expense of mafia.

I don‘t see how the Threesome was unkillable. You had Lust to block, she claimed her role D1, and the mafia Lover was even afk all N1

 

[Copy Panda]

 

[Shad]

I don‘t see how the Threesome was unkillable. You had Lust to block, she claimed her role D1, and the mafia Lover was even afk all N1

You guys keep repeating this, it won't make it true.

The hider could only hide behind the person they recruit, therefor mafia will kill the recruiter by killing there recruitment target.

Keep spinning it however you want, as being greedy or whatever, that is objectively the best move.

Mute the thread if you don't like it, I left you the pad to enjoy, where you could spam me to toxicity.

 

[GrySun]

Keep spinning it however you want, as being greedy

Okay if you‘re fine with it.

Greeeeeeedy!

 

[Copy Panda]

 

[Asako]

he recruiter was only killable as part of a double kill, which is something the mafia lover wasn't gonna let happen, the recruiter is also lynch immune.

So no the threesome candidate was protected from kills, the only way to discover this ploy was to fail a kill on them and question the misleading information provided by mafia lover, meanwhile the lovers are lynching exposed mafia and reducing their numbers.

you do realize shad that lovers themselves could killed the recruiter, they didn't know they were their threesome, if that happened they were done themselves

 

[Baka Taichou]

you do realize shad that lovers themselves could killed the recruiter, they didn't know they were their threesome, if that happened they were done themselves

i see that scenario happening only endgame , since lovers being on the inside of both mafia and masons would be extremely beneficial to their plans. And by the time that would be considered the threesome would run out of ppl to guess in game and would have already joined them.

and even if they did kill the threesome, it's not like they die, no?

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 6, 2022, Original Post Date: Nov 6, 2022 ---

(damn you gry, since this sig punishment "everybody" has been singing on repeat in the back of my head for the past 2 days which is weird af when you realize it) xD