Discussion Would legalizing regulated brothels be good or bad?

[danzouismadara]

Personally, I support the legalization of regulated brothels, since it's proven that it reduces the spread of stds( health checks + safe sex), and violent acts towards women, for instance rape and murder.
Plus, shouldn't people have the right to do what they want with their bodies, since in a sense, it's a form of freedom of speech? Plus, these women won't be able to do drugs, since they are tested for drugs as well, unlike street sex workers( no health checks), who work to get money for drugs, and are putting their lives in danger. Furthermore, in my opinion. there are corrupt cops, who probably get a cut from this form of prostitution(street), and many women are abused by their pimps.

I feel that there are many people in the world, who would offer sex for money anyways, so you might as well make sure that it's regulated, so that we can avoid the spread of diseases, plus brothels can serve as protection against those who may perform acts of violence towards an individual who is selling sex.

 

[M3J]

Legalizing brothels would be good for the workers as well as for society as a whole. Men and women would be checked more often for STD or any problem and are free to complain about any bad person that comes in, without fear of trouble. Not only that, but the government, being greedy little shits they are, can charge tax and make more money off regulated brothels. I also think prostitution should be legalized. Just seems safer to make both legal than keep it illegal and have high risks.

 

[REN KOUEN]

it would be great

however there is too muh human slavery involved...

 

[kkck]

Well, the industry so to speak already exists one way or another. People who are into this sort of thing are not about to stop paying for this sort of services even if they are for whatever reason illegal (they are not illegal where I am from but there is a lot of informality about it). Since the industry is not about to go anywhere under any circumstances even if the entire world mobilizes against it I would think it makes more sense to just formalize it and collect taxes on it and whatnot.

 

[danzouismadara]

it would be great

however there is too muh human slavery involved...

there is more human sex trafficking when it's illegal though.

 

[faintsmile1992]

Nothing wrong with brothels if they're regulated IMO.

Regulation is necessary to prevents STIs, unwanted pregnancy and abuse by pimps.

 

[zelllogan]

Regulation is of course the thing to do but it has downsides as well. In the nederlands, girls have trouble to win enough money. Rent is heavy, there are more taxes ...

But still, all in all, it's better. The red light district is the safest place in Amsterdam at night: cops control the area in order for girls to be secure. But when you visit the city, it's still weird to see a church next to a big fat african prostitute who is herself next to a school (It's not a random example, I trully saw that with my own eyes). Kind of surrealist really.

 

[REN KOUEN]

there is more human sex trafficking when it's illegal though.

yes this is obvious

i think if there was a way to regulate that the brothels were definitely not using extorted human slaves

i would be all for it, however sadly most of the "rub n tug" places in america (and im assuming in other countries as well) are certainly linked to human slavery

which is very sad and very wrong

 

[danzouismadara]

yes this is obvious

i think if there was a way to regulate that the brothels were definitely not using extorted human slaves

i would be all for it, however sadly most of the "rub n tug" places in america (and im assuming in other countries as well) are certainly linked to human slavery

which is very sad and very wrong

the should make a regulated like fast-food brothel, or is that messed up? lol

 

[kannazuki]

If brothels were regulated, I would think it would be all about enforcing much-needed labour and safety standards, as well as some laws protecting competition, I assume. Then there'd be the lucrative tax revenue. Zoning laws can also be amended to ensure that not too many people's delicate sensibilities are offended by having the facilities in question "too close" to their home or place of worship. Assuming all of that is adequately handled, there's still the stigmatization of people working (and going) to these places to deal with (on a societal level).

Why do fast food/retail workers get paid so little and receive such crappy hours in many places? Is there something inherently less merit-worthy about what they are doing? Not really. Just the cultural attitude that these aren't "real" jobs. Now just imagine how sex workers would be treated if they wanted an inflation-indexed wage increase or something. You'd think the toughest, most "degrading" (I don't see it that way personally but most people probably would) jobs that "no one" wants to do would be the best paying ones, but that's not how it works. Ask a live-in nanny, for example, or a home care worker for the elderly. That's back breaking work being done, and yet people doing these kinds of work are more liable to be exploited for unpaid overtime (off the books so they have no legal recourse) than to be patted on the back for a job well done.

 

[brajt]

The wage increase totally depends on the kind of your employment contract etc. In business such as brothels, it's not that uncommon for the girls to receive payment based on the number and kind of their clients, or even directly from them, not from the company they work for.

Also, it's mainly for employees of national companies, offices, schools, hospitals etc, where the levels of wages are regulated by law.

 

[kannazuki]

As of August this year:
Time Headline: Amnesty International Votes to Recommend Decriminalizing Sex Work

We spent more than two years gathering evidence through meetings with hundreds of individuals and organizations. We conducted first-hand research into the lived experience of sex workers under different national and legal contexts.

We would like to claim to be the first to address this issue. But we are not. Other groups which support or are calling for the decriminalization of sex work include the World Health Organization, UNAIDS, International Labour Organization, the Global Alliance Against Trafficking in Women, the Global Network of Sex Work Projects, the Global Commission on HIV and the Law, Human Rights Watch, the Open Society Foundations and Anti-Slavery International.

We have at all times committed to address trafficking. Trafficking is an abhorrent abuse of human rights and must be criminalized as a matter of international law. We do not consider a trafficked women who is forced to sell sex to be a ‘sex worker’. She is a trafficked woman and deserves protection as such.

https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2015/08/sex-workers-rights-are-human-rights/

Awesome. I was convinced of this some time ago (as my posts above would indicate) but it's only become clearer and clearer over time what a mistake it is to give in to public stigma to criminalize any aspect of sex work, and the idea that decriminalization somehow would boost trafficking is nonsensical and a red herring. What promotes trafficking is forcing them to operate in secret under either illegality or legal gray areas.

 

[Drmke]

Personally, in a perfect world, prostitution wouldn't be a thing. People shouldn't be for sale. HOWEVER, it is a thing and the workers need to be protected. Yes to regulations.

 

[kkck]

Prostitution doesn't imply people are for sale. It's not like you are buying the person, you are purchasing a service. The morality of it though is another issue.

 

[M3J]

Personally, in a perfect world, prostitution wouldn't be a thing. People shouldn't be for sale. HOWEVER, it is a thing and the workers need to be protected. Yes to regulations.

They're not for sale, but as long as the prostitute or gigolo agrees, I see nothing wrong with it. I'd judge a married person sleeping with a sex worker more than I would a sex worker, tbh.

 

[Drmke]

The "service" is a part of your body. Someone pays you to use a portion of your body for sexual purposes. It appears to be a fairly degrading profession that people are forced into either by direct force or societal pressures. I find it difficult to see it from any sort of "libertarian" (my words) standpoint where the only consideration is explicit consent.

 

[M3J]

It's seen as degrading due to society's limited mind. Slut shaming is prevalent, so of course female sex workers will be seen as lower than scum. How many people think of male sex workers as "sluts" or bad? Even normal men are celebrated for having multiple sexual partners while women are criticized.

There are many sex workers that are in the business for pleasure and money, just as there are strippers that enjoy what they do, or the easy money they make. Not that I'm denying there are sex workers who were forced into the business one way or another. I think there are more of them who had no choice but to go into prostitution to survive or were forced to become a prostitute, especially due to human trafficking. That's the shit I have a problem with, personally, and it seems like human trafficking could reduce significantly if prostitution is legalized.

But then, the problem is they could find another way to continue trafficking. Maybe go after minors? It's a hard situation because sex is always in demand, but I don't see why sex workers don't deserve the same protection and rights that others do.

 

[kannazuki]

They already traffic children right along with adults, for all sorts of modern slave labour, including to be molested. I've read in the past that traffickers often benefit from the fact their victims will be arrested and immediately deported (which I suppose means they get a criminal record) if they try to go to the police, because they're usually foreign nationals who were abducted or smuggled across borders under false pretenses. Like the Russian women who try to go to Turkey to become housekeepers but instead end up either captured there or smuggled to some other country where they don't have a visa and/or their ID and passport get confiscated. Then they're kept locked up to be molested against their will. Thanks to the judgment and stigma against even legal, consensual sex work, those trapped in this situation are still treated with contempt and not as the vulnerable victims.

Meanwhile, independent adults who choose sex work seem to be patronized by those who think they are children who can't decide for themselves. Why is society so judgmental of even the most completely harmless choices that people make for themselves? I remember thinking that way myself in the past, but there was never a strong rational reason for assuming no one could freely choose sex work. There are all kinds of things that are stigmatized and yet people still freely choose to do them anyway.

 

[M3J]

They already traffic children right along with adults, for all sorts of modern slave labour, including to be molested. I've read in the past that traffickers often benefit from the fact their victims will be arrested and immediately deported (which I suppose means they get a criminal record) if they try to go to the police, because they're usually foreign nationals who were abducted or smuggled across borders under false pretenses. Like the Russian women who try to go to Turkey to become housekeepers but instead end up either captured there or smuggled to some other country where they don't have a visa and/or their ID and passport get confiscated. Then they're kept locked up to be molested against their will. Thanks to the judgment and stigma against even legal, consensual sex work, those trapped in this situation are still treated with contempt and not as the vulnerable victims.

I meant they'd go after more children and increase the amount of children to traffic. Take more risk, more like.

Meanwhile, independent adults who choose sex work seem to be patronized by those who think they are children who can't decide for themselves. Why is society so judgmental of even the most completely harmless choices that people make for themselves? I remember thinking that way myself in the past, but there was never a strong rational reason for assuming no one could freely choose sex work. There are all kinds of things that are stigmatized and yet people still freely choose to do them anyway.

Even normal women who aren't even in the business get judged and are called "whores" or "hos" or some other dumb shit. I don't think men are patronized or seen as negative for the most part, whether they have multiple sex partners or are in the sex industry somehow, while women are judged to the point that men think it's not rape regardless of them strongly objecting to sex.

Prostitution will not go away, sex will always be in demand. It's so dumb to keep it illegal and make it harder for the workers to get proper healthcare and safety. Makes no sense to blame prostitutes when the men/women are the ones voluntarily paying for their services. It's like blaming the lover when the cheater chose to cheat.

 

[Drmke]

Yes, it was wrong of me to make a grandiose statement about no one choosing on their own to do sex work. However, I stand by the rest of what I said. It's not a matter of "slut shaming" and prudishness. People should be free to have sexual relations with whoever they want whenever as much as they want they want providing basic consent. My probably is when it becomes a business transaction; it's the literal commodification of the human body which I see as a serious negative.