Discussion - Erza Scarlet Thread | Page 10 | MangaHelpers



  • Join in and nominate your favorite shows of the summer season 2023!

Discussion Erza Scarlet Thread

Kenneth Latorre

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Jul 17, 2019
Messages
994
Reaction score
1,473
Age
26
Country
United States
Erza was rightfully hated for being a Mary Sue. Can’t say she has that problem in the current story. she is more relatable when she is just like any other character from the guild. It’s honestly more fun that way.
 

sharkai

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Jul 3, 2016
Messages
2,023
Reaction score
1,038
Age
34
Country
United States
Erza was rightfully hated for being a Mary Sue. Can’t say she has that problem in the current story. she is more relatable when she is just like any other character from the guild. It’s honestly more fun that way.
define mary sue please.
who is not mary sue in fairy tail
natsu?laxus?gildarts?
 

Ratrace

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Nov 18, 2018
Messages
1,572
Reaction score
1,092
Age
34
Country
United States
define mary sue please.
who is not mary sue in fairy tail
natsu?laxus?gildarts?
They are the top members and Hiro probably doesn't want to destroy their hype
 

Hexbend

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Nov 13, 2019
Messages
863
Reaction score
1,192
Age
22
Country
United States
None of them are Mary Sues lmao neither is Erza
 

Kenneth Latorre

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Jul 17, 2019
Messages
994
Reaction score
1,473
Age
26
Country
United States
natsu?laxus?gildarts?
Two of them actually don’t have insane asspulls that make unbelievable things happen. Erza back then could have pulled planet slicing blades out her ass and the excuse would be cause she is Erza, just like happy once said.

natsu also isn’t on the same level as Erza in terms of asspulls. His asspulls could at least be rationalized with the whole hybrid thing going on with him. Not that I like it tho.
 

sharkai

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Jul 3, 2016
Messages
2,023
Reaction score
1,038
Age
34
Country
United States
Two of them actually don’t have insane asspulls that make unbelievable things happen. Erza back then could have pulled planet slicing blades out her ass and the excuse would be cause she is Erza, just like happy once said.

natsu also isn’t on the same level as Erza in terms of asspulls. His asspulls could at least be rationalized with the whole hybrid thing going on with him. Not that I like it tho.
Lol what.
Mages without magic simply die. Unless you are gildarts fighting against bluenote. Bluenote couldn't kill him even then. Then he comes back and is suddenly springgan plus tier.

Laxus with cancer improved more than Jura. Yeah no. Then that laxus suddenly has that lightening which wahl couldnt redirect and was super weak to. That fight was an example of extreme ass pull. And kiria didn't work on him because his heart was weak lol

Natsu ass pulls are extreme. How do you think he beat immortal zeref with infinite magic. Natsu has ass pulls in nearly every fight. And some are stupid as hell. Didnt natsu borrow.magic from.his future self in edolas arc

Ass pulls dont make one a mary sue. Fairy tail fights are full of ass pulls. Do you.know that gajeel wins all his.fights since tenrou by eating his enemy or there weapon
Mary Sue is like gildarts or laxus. Perfect in every way. Natsu is also.going there since alverzec.
Problem with erza is her magic. Mishma doesn't know how to use it and then gives her enemy who cannot be beaten in any logical way by pretty much anyone.
 

grey matter

Registered User
MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted
Joined
Dec 4, 2019
Messages
6,489
Reaction score
9,859
Age
27
Gender
Male
Country
India
Lol what.
Mages without magic simply die. Unless you are gildarts fighting against bluenote. Bluenote couldn't kill him even then. Then he comes back and is suddenly springgan plus tier.

Laxus with cancer improved more than Jura. Yeah no. Then that laxus suddenly has that lightening which wahl couldnt redirect and was super weak to. That fight was an example of extreme ass pull. And kiria didn't work on him because his heart was weak lol

Natsu ass pulls are extreme. How do you think he beat immortal zeref with infinite magic. Natsu has ass pulls in nearly every fight. And some are stupid as hell. Didnt natsu borrow.magic from.his future self in edolas arc

Ass pulls dont make one a mary sue. Fairy tail fights are full of ass pulls. Do you.know that gajeel wins all his.fights since tenrou by eating his enemy or there weapon
Mary Sue is like gildarts or laxus. Perfect in every way. Natsu is also.going there since alverzec.
Problem with erza is her magic. Mishma doesn't know how to use it and then gives her enemy who cannot be beaten in any logical way by pretty much anyone.
Completely agree with the first part of what you wrote there. Well except for this part - Bluenote simply chose to play with Gildarts instead of killing him; mages without magic eventually die from withdrawal symptoms, not die immediately
But, what you said is applicable to EVERY relevant "good guy". They had insanely unrealistic growth between x791 and x792, including Erza

What people generally refer to, when they call Erza "Mary Sue" is her utter dogshit fights. With the exception of Natsu's multiple revivals from the dead (against Animus, Zeref and Wraith) and his fight against FH Zeref, literally nothing else even comes close to being comparable with what Erza pulls off.
And, Natsu (rightfully) gets called out all the time. Natsu and Erza are the most BS characters in FT, so they get called out. Erza gets called out more, because her BS started way earlier.
 

sharkai

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Jul 3, 2016
Messages
2,023
Reaction score
1,038
Age
34
Country
United States
Completely agree with the first part of what you wrote there. Well except for this part - Bluenote simply chose to play with Gildarts instead of killing him; mages without magic eventually die from withdrawal symptoms, not die immediately
But, what you said is applicable to EVERY relevant "good guy". They had insanely unrealistic growth between x791 and x792, including Erza

What people generally refer to, when they call Erza "Mary Sue" is her utter dogshit fights. With the exception of Natsu's multiple revivals from the dead (against Animus, Zeref and Wraith) and his fight against FH Zeref, literally nothing else even comes close to being comparable with what Erza pulls off.
And, Natsu (rightfully) gets called out all the time. Natsu and Erza are the most BS characters in FT, so they get called out. Erza gets called out more, because her BS started way earlier.
Then she shouldn't get shit enemies like koyoka. I mean how the fuk can one even beat koyoka.
Just imagine, if koyoka faught etherious mard, but with important clause. Koyoka hax works fine on him. How the hell is mard gonna beat koyoka with extreme pain from just standing and without any senses (including knowing where your limbs are, that is a sense as well)
Or if she is fighting super powered villians like tenrou tree azuma and irene, give her a god damn power up. No no. Nakama speech is all she gets :notamused
 

grey matter

Registered User
MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted
Joined
Dec 4, 2019
Messages
6,489
Reaction score
9,859
Age
27
Gender
Male
Country
India
Then she shouldn't get shit enemies like koyoka. I mean how the fuk can one even beat koyoka.
Just imagine, if koyoka faught etherious mard, but with important clause. Koyoka hax works fine on him. How the hell is mard gonna beat koyoka with extreme pain from just standing and without any senses (including knowing where your limbs are, that is a sense as well)
Or if she is fighting super powered villians like tenrou tree azuma and irene, give her a god damn power up. No no. Nakama speech is all she gets :notamused
Take it up with Mashima lmao. He's the one who gives Erza OP hax enemies in order to wank her. When people call out Erza, it's obviously indirectly calling out Mashima's writing of that.
 

sharkai

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Jul 3, 2016
Messages
2,023
Reaction score
1,038
Age
34
Country
United States
Take it up with Mashima lmao. He's the one who gives Erza OP hax enemies in order to wank her. When people call out Erza, it's obviously indirectly calling out Mashima's writing of that.
i wish erza gets cqc opponents. she performs so much better then. laxus vs erza, azuma vs erza (not the ending) were pretty good fights
 

grey matter

Registered User
MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted
Joined
Dec 4, 2019
Messages
6,489
Reaction score
9,859
Age
27
Gender
Male
Country
India
i wish erza gets cqc opponents. she performs so much better then. laxus vs erza, azuma vs erza (not the ending) were pretty good fights
Personally, I didn't like Erza vs Laxus. But yes, I agree with that, in general. Erza vs Kagura and Erza vs Midnight were my favs. Erza vs Ajeel was decent as well.

Don't even necessarily need to be cqc (Midnight fight wasn't and I believe it's regarded as the best Erza fight). Just need to make sense and show some form of strategy/versatility - not just red pants solo.

I hate hax opponents in general. They make fights very asspull-ish; and almost necessarily make the opponents retarded, since CIS from enemies will be the only way good guys can win.
 
Last edited:

Darklord#10

Registered User
有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity
Joined
Jan 11, 2022
Messages
2,944
Reaction score
2,571
Age
20
Gender
Male
Country
Nigeria
Thanks for pointing this out. With the series about to be done and dusted with, I might as well address, aka rant about, the incorrigible character of Erza.

We should have thought nothing about her would even surprise the readers anymore. But no, because Erza Scarlet is a terrible character. Now, I'm just not out here to bash this chick for no good reason. I'm going to try to explain how she is bad, and how she could be made good.

To show how Erza is bad, let me use a character that is written well.


This is Wendy. She is faced with the challenge of preventing Face from happening before the diminishing time.

A good choice is when you have got a goal, you put an obstacle in their way, and a character has a decision to make between two valid options of getting around that problem. Depending on their prominence to the plot, these choices only happen a few times to each character. But when they do happen, they make the characters feel something. They also make the readers feel something as well. And that is what the readers want.

During the Tartaros arc. Wendy has to make choices which,

- reveal her character
- move the plot forward
- defy the readers' expectations


Here, Wendy has an inner monologue which reveals her character.

By observing her surroundings, she is able to connect the dots from the air nearby, to the Ethernano near Face. This shows a keen awareness, and critical thinking when under pressure. She contemplates mixing the two and utilizing it inside her body in a manner which Natsu theoretically does. And the readers are able to feel she has always been observing how Natsu fights, and that she has always been playing catch up. The readers are living through her, as they experience all these feelings.

On the subject of environment, such a power up does not feel random or forced, as it has been brought up in foreshadowing by other characters before.



Such monoglue within her shows the internal path she has to take before arriving to a decision. It's not a handout, where you receive gifts on a silver freaking platter.

Erza? She does not do anything like that at all. She makes choices that are forced on her. What we call plot reactions.


Beat Kyouka and stop Face? Or don't beat Kyouka and don't stop Face?



Beat Azuma and restore Tenrou Tree? Or don't beat Azuma and don't restore Tenrou Tree?

Yes, I'm positive those are very hard choices to make. :kappa

Plot reactions. Erza was put in a position where she has to do something. Or stay exactly where she is. And staying exactly where you are is never a choice. Because the plot is going to move without you. So she has to react. And just do the thing the plot is telling her to do. Therefore, these choices are hardly valid because they are no longer choices which reveal your character, but rather no-brainer.

Wendy, however, was unable to stop Face despite defeating Ezel. But due to Charle's prophecy and future sight, she was able to find a way of deactivating Face. This, comes at the expense of their lives. So again, Wendy has to make a choice here. A choice between sacrificing herself together with Charle, or for the sake of preserving the magic world.





These are two real options. We need to remember now that even without magic in the world, it is not fatal to magicians and they won't die directly from a result of that. But they will be weaken and as such, become susceptible to enemies' attacks. In other words, Wendy chose to prioritize the safety of her comrades over her own life.

As she flashes back to her past, the readers are able to go on an emotional journey, and feel the impact of Wendy and Charle's sacrifices.






Then Erza successfully defeated Kyouka. Of course, she did. But the timer still doesn't stop unless you kill her. She ran out of energy, so Minerva dealt the lethal blow.




But oh no, it has counted down to zero. So all magic is going to disppear from the continent? Well, guess we will find out in the next chapter of Fair . . .

Except the story instantly shifted back to Mard's altercation with the dragon slayers! And it was eventually revealed the parent dragons were already on standby, then show up right after that, and swiftly destroyed all Faces. So Erza's fight which was supposed to be the last one standing prior to Mard, the battle that supposedly determine the fate of the magic world, does not, in the grand scheme of things, actually matter one bit. It had no connection to any other element in the story. It did not move the plot forward.

It was like the fight was just there. It served no real purpose.

Wendy's fight with Ezel showed not only the threat of Face. It also showed us the gravity of the threat multiplied by a thousand fold.




And this moved the plot forward by reinforcing the threat of Tartaros.

Then we move on to the actual fight itself. The fight where despite being wounded and exhausted from her earlier fight with Minerva, and Kyouka had seemingly absorbed Seilah to boost her strength, Erza was utterly wrecked by Kyouka's abilities.




But something happened. Something that would make Shakespeare turn in his grave. Erza broke the rules of the logical confines of a story being told. She got up, despite losing all her senses, and proceeded to beat the tar out of the Kyouka. With the explanation being 'Because she's Erza'. The atrocity was unreal.

Here was Kyouka, or rather Mashima, letting us know what Erza is.


She does not feel any pain or fear. These character traits are what makes a human, a human. Not possessing these does not make Erza unique. No, they don't. They make her unrelatable. The readers are not able to register with Erza because she is an object. A terminator completely devoid of any relatable traits. And the sorry thing is, Erza has never changed one bit. Since the beginning, that is her in a nutshell. There is no growth to her character, no logic behind her, no emotional feedback between her and the readers.

On the other hand, Wendy grew. She went from someone who was scared stiff by bugs.


To deepening her resolve of fighting on her own two feet.



Because of the events she went through, and choices she had to make, she has transformed. She is still Wendy, but no longer the Wendy we knew. Same, but different. She reversed all expectations the readers had of her initially. And that, my friends, is storytelling.
Damn I didn't know someone would still teach me about fairy tail again. I don't really like fanfiction to be quite frank I despise it but if you do happen to write one I might want to read it. You're really good bro.

I also want to point out one stupid moment from Erza. She said she felt happy after seeing laxus cuz she was worried about the guild defense line, but the reason she and laxus were even fighting was because the defense line got breached and I find it quite dumb that she was worried about the defense line when there's laxus very cocky and arrogant
 

Ronin31

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
May 8, 2020
Messages
1,067
Reaction score
1,334
Gender
Male
Country
France
She said she felt happy after seeing laxus cuz she was worried about the guild defense line, but the reason she and laxus were even fighting was because the defense line got breached and I find it quite dumb that she was worried about the defense line when there's laxus very cocky and arrogant
It may seem awkward, but from my point of view, her concern remains legitimate. She did not think that Laxus had reached this level in a year. With her, Natsu and Grey are also among the strongest in the Guild, diminishing the strength of the Guild in their absence, and Wendy is the support and healer.

Indeed, the Guild’s line of defense was indeed destroyed in their absence by Toùka, hence their clash on Aldoron, but the fact that Laxus became so strong gave Erza lost confidence. So yes, once back to normal, Laxus will be powerful enough to replace her and be the guardian of the Guild in their absence. In this sense, yes, her clumsy reasoning about the moment, stands on the future the time to finish the Quest.
 

Kiki

Ruin me, Ruan Mei
九千以上だ! / Kyuusen Ijou Da! / It's Over 9000!
Mangahelper
Joined
Aug 23, 2015
Messages
9,916
Reaction score
30,586
Gender
Male
Country
Vietnam
How do you rank Erza's armors based on:
1. Design
2. Power
 

Darklord#10

Registered User
有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity
Joined
Jan 11, 2022
Messages
2,944
Reaction score
2,571
Age
20
Gender
Male
Country
Nigeria
How do you rank Erza's armors based on:
1. Design
2. Power
You mean which is better? For me I prefer the design. Hiro rarely misses when it comes to design
 

Kiki

Ruin me, Ruan Mei
九千以上だ! / Kyuusen Ijou Da! / It's Over 9000!
Mangahelper
Joined
Aug 23, 2015
Messages
9,916
Reaction score
30,586
Gender
Male
Country
Vietnam
no, I mean rank her armors based on those categories, not comparing design and power lol
 

grey matter

Registered User
MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted
Joined
Dec 4, 2019
Messages
6,489
Reaction score
9,859
Age
27
Gender
Male
Country
India
How do you rank Erza's armors based on:
1. Design
2. Power
1. The one she used against Midnight, don't remember the name, but it's the one that stretches a lot and is purple in colour. I remember liking that armour so much.
I also liked the black dragon/wing armour. Looked unique compared to her usual armous.

2. No armour (Mashima actually did that lmao, still cracks me up). Red pants >> everything else
 
Top