Conditional Gray vs Erza

[Lucy>Wendy&Elfman]

Well. I said Erza would win high-diff. My opinion changed: she mid-diffs Gray.

 

[AmitDS]

I think the whole situation with Gray and (even Gajeel based on power scaling i.e. Gray = Gajeel, and Natsu's comment about Mira/Laxus/Jellal being stronger) is hilarious & weird because we are to assume that Mira's weakest form is notably beyond them and only comparable to them when she's heavily injured so feats and hype , whether intentional or not on Mashima's part, make it so that Laxus and Erza low diffing Gray or even Gajeel can logically happen. lol And if Mira's is weak to DeS it makes it worse for Gray.

 

[grey matter]

Mashima writes weird, don't really know what to make of these contradictory feats

But one thing I know is x784 base Natsu alone would give x784 Erza a low-mid diff.

And the gap between them has only decreased as time has progressed.

By scaling, current LFD Natsu would give current Erza without enchantments a high diff, and current Erza with enchantments a mid-high diff.
ISM Gajeel and DeS Gray scales to LFD Natsu, so IMO:

Erza wins high diff against Gray if DS seal + DS/DeS swords were a one time thing/ need pre-prep
Erza wins mid diff if she can use them whenever she wants


I don't see her low diffing DeS Gray in any scenario, that is underrating Gray (not surprised that people do this, considering how Mashima has been treating Gray lately)

 

[Ronin31]

I don't see her low diffing DeS Gray in any scenario, that is underrating Gray (not surprised that people do this, considering how Mashima has been treating Gray lately)

Yes I can agree.
For me, the "low-diff" is more against régular Ice Make. But people seems to underestimate Grey due to Mahsima's Mirajane's overhype. I can understand them and this is why I said we can have different opinions about this.

To be honest, I can see Erza low-mid diff régular Grey, mid-high diff him as Devil Slayer.

Erza, like Laxus, is a beast when she is determinate to destroy a foe.

Grey is not that bad either : strategic, good offensive and defensive Magic, good physical stats. He is a versatile one. Erza is like him, but on a higher level, just like Natsu is Laxus character's like : an offensive destroyer character.

 

[AmitDS]

Lol how did I miss this?

If you consider this Grey as his best, well ok.
Let him unlock his potential again. But Jacob was surely stronger than END who onslaught Dimaria.

And Erza's bare hands stronger than all?

Spoiler

Halphas doesn't exist in the Manga. Sitri was above Satan Soul but not so far away if we consider her fight vs Seilha.
Alegria is her best, as one shot just like Lucy's Star Dress Mix which is expendable vs Skullion.

You don't know how much stronger Sitri is though since Seilah hit her before she could hit Seilah BUT Elfman was shown strong enough to knock out Seilah so Seilah appears to be a glass canon.

The arc where Halphas was introduced was referenced in the manga and Halphas was designed by Mashima. Regardless, IIRC, I mentioned 'IN THE ANIME' when speaking about Halphas.

Grey and Mira's attacks were all useless vs Skullion. Show me a pict where Mirajane damages him.

"Show me a pict"

Lol I love how you guys use this, while fully well knowing their fight was off panel for the most part and Mirajane damaged him more than Gray did. Okay. Show me a pic of Mira losing to Skullion?

Spoiler

Btw other, stronger people had trouble damaging Skullion at first so...

Spoiler

Devil Slayer Grey blitz Skullion.

Skullion passed turning serious with AoE spell turning Ocean as Ashes : That shows the gap with regular Grey

DS Grey fought magicly Skullion's heavy AoE and they countered each other

Skullion used a stronger spell to end the fight. Name Spell is usally "elite" spell (Kaméhaméha is stronger than no name Ki blast launch with two hands in same way)

Yeah let's ignore flashes of Mira holding her own against him

All that and Skullion beat him easily while he was damaged and gave up vs Mira. So really what's the point?

To be honest, Skullion was more serious vs Grey than vs Mirajane, perhaps because he couldn't use such power with Madmol close to him.

Um first of all this is all your headcanon and secondly Mirajane with all her nukes can be argued to have been holding back so as not to harm her brother, as well.

Actually if you want to play that game, there is more evidence that Mira held back than Skullion since:

-We know that was Mira's weakest form
-We saw how Mira was playing with Lucy and her spirits (holding back and tying them up)
- Mira literally admitted that she holds back when she's being watched (Elfman was with her).

There is literally no proof that Skullion held back vs Mira and Elfman when we saw him visibly injured when he tied with Mira and then we heard him say Mira and Elfman were strong and they couldn't beat them (the siblings said the same).

Lol yeah he was so serious here. compared to vs Mirajane.

Spoiler

You said Mirajane wasn't at her peak. Neither was Grey. His peak is Berserker mode used vs END in which he is far stronger (look Invel's fight in analogy).

So you mean Gray needs power of friendship or rage mode when Juvia dies to be strong? Okay well that has nothing to do with power scaling and hypothetical matchups AND Erza's bare hands tanked him and END Natsu's attacks back then so...

Spoiler

Currently, both Grey and Mira are below Skullion.

Nope. Only Gray. Mira tied with Skullion, injured him more and Gray admitted that he was struggling to beat heavily injured Mirajane. Why is this so hard to understand? Is the sexism, bias towards Gray or bias against Mira so great?

Can we stop being out of subject ? If you consider Mirajane >>> Grey, ok then... I don't have to make you think another way.
We can have different opinion, right ?

We cant stop being 'out of subject' when you guys stop basically lying about Mirajane.
Having an opinion on if Mirajane is stronger than Gray or not is not the same as having an opinion about which flavor ice-cream is the best, for example.
You are acting as though your opinions with no backing in the source material are equal to my claims which are backed up in the manga and that is not the case.

If Skullion was holding back vs Mira then prove it.
If Gray was not going all out against Mira then prove it.
If Mira is weaker than Skullion then prove it.
If Gray didn't use DeS vs Mira then prove it.

It's crazy how people are coping because Mashima crap all over their wrong powerscaling opinions in the sequel. It shouldn't be surprising though, Mira was always stronger than Gray and only when he got DeS people thought he finally surpassed her despite Mira absorbing all of Tartaros in the same arc and then having a year of training just like Gray did. His spriggan fight and END fight was dripping with power of friendship/ power of his rage/emotions and logically was never meant to be taken seriously when scaling him vs Laxus, Natsu, Erza and even Gajeel and Mirajane. Now look who Mashima ended up proving to be right, Mirajane, Erza and Laxus fans who each maintained that Gray was not stronger than their favs.

On topic: Skullion vs Mirajane, Skullion vs Gray, Heavily injured Mira vs Gray, Laxus vs Erza & Natsu's comment about Laxus/Mira/Jellal > Gajeel, all support that Erza could possibly low diff Gray, so it's low diff at least going by feats AND hype.

 

[Ronin31]

I ask you last questions :

You said Mirajane held back vs Skullion, right ?

Why won't she use stronger forms to destroy Skullion easily and then turned to team up with Elfman to vanquish Mardmole ? Why didn't she use her strongest powers, her so stronger powers to destroy both Diabolos's guy if she is so superior to them ?

Even on the pict you posted, she admitted that Elfman and her can't defeat them : with this evidence, Mirajane didn't hold back but gave her all, right ?

Same evidence as Grey going all out vs Mirajane by Jubia's statement.

I also can assume that Natsu gave his all vs Gajeel to nearly exaust all his MP. Did he use Dragon Force or even FDK ?

So, can't they go all out in regular mode ? Why Grey is so different from both Mirajane's and Natsu's situations ?

Waiting for Mira to be weakened was a good option as she is highly stronger than his regular mode. You have to think that Elfman was also still here and could support her as well.

- In my mind, FDK or Dragon Force are hot enough to melt Gajeel's Iron body to kill him. Will he use that against a friend ?
- In my mind, Grey's Magic can kill demons who have stats higher than his own, even by some mergin : I assume Tempester (Natsu couldn't beat him) and Mard Geer were highly above his stats but his Magic could kill them. Will he use it against a friend who was already injured and weakened, with same vulnerability to his Magic's Nature ? I assume Mirajane is as strong as Grey's Devil Slayer and perhaps stronger but not so far. But I also assume his Magic is more dangerous for Mira rather than Mira's for Grey. I f you don't agree reread Tartaros.

For me, Natsu and Grey had restrictions in their fights.

The fact is that I can't see same restriction for Mirajane while fighting ennemies. So, why didn't she use her strongest forms while we have even seen Elfman with a new one, with higher strength and durability by Leo's statements ?

Same for Lisanna :

I saw on another topic that you think Mirajane equal Erza. Sorry but you have to proove that Mirajane can tie Laxus RL for that.
Both Erza and Laxus are currently on higher stats by some mergin.

 

[AmitDS]

I ask you last questions :

You said Mirajane held back vs Skullion, right ?

No I said that if you're arguing that Skullion held back then there is an argument for Mira too since like Skullion, she had a partner there and stronger known forms while unlike Skullion she has said she doesn't show her true power around others. You think you alone can cry held back to defend a character? I see what you're doing. You're trying to save Gray by claiming Skullion was at full power vs him but not Mira when the opposite is true.

Why won't she use stronger forms to destroy Skullion easily and then turned to team up with Elfman to vanquish Mardmole ? Why didn't she use her strongest powers, her so stronger powers to destroy both Diabolos's guy if she is so superior to them ?

Idk go ask Mashima. Your question doesn't prove or disprove anything unlike Gray we know she didn't use her strongest form to lose to him. Maybe you need to reread the manga? I can think of various reasons why she didn't do it but unlike you I don't see my headcanons as facts so I don't pretend they are.

Even on the pict you posted, she admitted that Elfman and her can't defeat them : with this evidence, Mirajane didn't hold back but gave her all, right ?

Same evidence as Grey going all out vs Mirajane by Jubia's statement.

So you admit that Gray went all out too barely beat heavily injured Mira? Okay

Why did Skullion agree that he can't beat her either but smiled as he beat Gray with no real injury , though?

I also can assume that Natsu gave his all vs Gajeel to nearly exaust all his MP. Did he use Dragon Force or even FDK ?

So, can't they go all out in regular mode ? Why Grey is so different from both Mirajane's and Natsu's situations ?

Yeah you do a lot of assuming.
Again go ask Mashima. Your questions don't debunk the manga facts as we know them. Mira and Natsu have stronger forms. Gray does not have a stronger form than DeS and those spells outside of maybe him raging if Juvia dies which Weakened Erza with no defense can block with one arm

Gray lost to Skullion using two of his four known DeS spells.

Mira tied with him in the form known as her weakest takeover then proceeded to give Gray an extreme diff fight.

What's there to discuss? If you think Mira isn't stronger in another form like Sitri then the burden is on your to prove it. We all know Sitri and Alegria are stronger but consume more magical power. It was stated in the manga already so...

Waiting for Mira to be weakened was a good option as she is highly stronger than his regular mode. You have to think that Elfman was also still here and could support her as well.

You are not serious
Waiting for Mira to be heavily injured and then struggling still means he's stronger? Really?

Cana said and Gray agreed that Mira was the one who he struggled with not Elfman. Why can't you get that through your head and reread the manga? Wow. You can repeat these wrong points all you want but we all know the truth and that is the issue you can't overcome.

- In my mind, FDK or Dragon Force are hot enough to melt Gajeel's Iron body to kill him. Will he use that against a friend ?
- In my mind, Grey's Magic can kill demons who have stats higher than his own, even by some mergin : I assume Tempester (Natsu couldn't beat him) and Mard Geer were highly above his stats but his Magic could kill them. Will he use it against a friend who was already injured and weakened, with same vulnerability to his Magic's Nature ? I assume Mirajane is as strong as Grey's Devil Slayer and perhaps stronger but not so far. But I also assume his Magic is more dangerous for Mira rather than Mira's for Grey. I f you don't agree reread Tartaros.

In your mind doesn't count. In Mashima's manga Gray said she had no weakness before seeing her family was her weakness and Lucy said only her family is her weakness.

In Mashima's manga Cana and Gray agreed that Gray's devil slaying freezing would fail on her like it did Skullion.

For me, Natsu and Grey had restrictions in their fights.

For Mashima, Cana, Gray and Juvia, Gray had none so...

The fact is that I can't see same restriction for Mirajane while fighting ennemies. So, why didn't she use her strongest forms while we have even seen Elfman with a new one, with higher strength and durability by Leo's statements ?

Same for Lisanna :

So why didn't Gray just one shot her with his OP devil slaying magic?

So why did Gray struggle?

I saw on another topic that you think Mirajane equal Erza. Sorry but you have to proove that Mirajane can tie Laxus RL for that.
Both Erza and Laxus are currently on higher stats by some mergin.

Moving the goal post are we?

See the beauty of my post is that I said I THINK recent hype and feats SUPPORT that she is on Erza's level as in she can be placed on Erza's level with these and it would make sense in canon eg. Due to her expected performance against Gray or Gajeel in her strongest forms based on her performance vs Gray and Skullion in her weakest. I didn't say it is a fact I have proven and anyone who disagrees with me is wrong.

And it's funny because all you people claiming that Erza mid diffs Gray are literally agreeing with my OPINION that isn't debunked rn, indirectly and you don't even know it. Skullion low diffed him. Mira tied with Skullion. Heavily injured Mira gave him extreme diff. But Erza low or mid diffs him? And he had an advantage over Mira to boot? Hmm... Interesting.


Again, on topic.
Whatever Skullion did to Gray, Erza does at least that. Call it low or mid diff idc

 

[Ronin31]

You think you alone can cry held back to defend a character? I see what you're doing. You're trying to save Gray by claiming Skullion was at full power vs him but not Mira when the opposite is true.

Not at all. I don't want to save anyone, neither Grey, neither Mirajane. I respect both in characters and their powers.
You don't.

So you admit that Gray went all out too barely beat heavily injured Mira? Okay

Yes, and I said that previously, just like Natsu did vs Gajeel. Neither used their trump cards in their respective fights.
I also said that Mira had support and Elfman is also a tough one.

Cana said and Gray agreed that Mira was the one who he struggled with not Elfman.

Lucy said Elfman was here too but Mirajane's overhype shadows him as a comic scene since the beginning of the dialogue.
Or tell me, who defeats Elfman when the girls run away in different places to take Gajeel and Makarov in the cards while he was fighting ?

In your mind doesn't count.

Sorry, you are omniscient and I can't have idea and point of view. Apologies.
- Natsu used Dragon Force vs Gajeel, for sure. I haven't seen it.
- Grey used Devil Slayer vs Mirajane, for sure. I haven't seen it.

For Mashima, Cana, Gray and Juvia, Gray had none so...

Yes, fighting a friend is not an handicap.

So why didn't Gray just one shot her with his OP devil slaying magic?

She is a friend, not a Mard Geer or END. Nevermind how powerful she is.

So why did Gray struggle?

Mirajane is too strong to be beaten in his regular mode and has risk to be too much injured with DS Magic while being previously weakened.
Struggling is fair here against 2 weakened opponents while removing deadly moves.

If you knows DC Universe, it's like Shazam (Captain Marvel) vs Superman : Shazam will have hard time taking down Superman in physicals as they are close one and even can be beaten here. If Shazam uses his Magic inside his physicals, he can two shots him due to Superman's weaknesses to Magic.
Is it hard to understand ?

It's not about stats here, but weaknesses : Mirajane takes over demons,

I didn't say it is a fact I have proven and anyone who disagrees with me is wrong.

Yes, again, you are omniscient. Apologies.

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 31, 2021, Original Post Date: Oct 31, 2021 ---

Due to her expected performance against Gray or Gajeel in her strongest forms based on her performance vs Gray and Skullion in her weakest.

So, why didn't she use her strongest forms to destroy Skullion and Mardmole if she is so above ??
She said she couldn't defeat Skullion so she did her best against him.

 

[Kiki]

a lot of pics. please use spoiler tags

 

[Ronin31]

a lot of pics. please use spoiler tags

Yes, I am sorry. I will be careful.

 

[bugen]

@Ronin31
@AmitDS



The downside of off-panel fights is that it leaves a lot of gaps unanswered.

You two can be right and vice versa because the fight is up to the imagination of each one, only the result and power of both teams is known, and both are evenly matched.

Mirajane could have used more off-panel transformations or just used his regular battle form throughout the match, we can't tell, but what we do know is that they were both fighting for real and with no apparent winner.

If it turns out that Gray faces Skullion in the next matches and Gray wins, then this would put Gray on a level very close to Mirajane, since Mirajane and Skullion are similar in power and anyone could win.

With Erza vs Gray, if it is a friendly match I can imagine it in victory for Erza with mid diff, but if it is a serious match then Erza wins more easily because of what is shown in the manga.

 

[Ronin31]

Agree but we have to take account circumstances in battles.

For me, it's clear that Mirajane gave her all vs Skullion to a withsdraw (she said to Elfman they could loose the battle if they continued).
Today, Skullion is a wall for both Mirajane and Grey. So I still put them at same rate.

One giving more resistance or last longer than another is not necessary above. I can take Laxus and Erza as exemple.
Kyria gave a mid diff to Erza and a low diff to Laxus in regular mode. Same exemple for Grey and Mira vs Skullion. If the point is correct, Laxus should trash Erza in a battle without much difficulty, even in regular mode. The result is yet a draw vs Laxus using all the power of the RL.

But if in a revenge battle, Grey manages to win by himself without external help (element or person), then I will see him as the guy who break this wall.
So I will not see him at Mirajane's level like currently, but above.

In close future, I can see Grey teaming up with Gajeel vs Skullion and Mardmole (I really hope this team-up). If FT wins, I will see this team above Mira's.

Like I said, it's not about stats here but effectivities and this is where I am misunderstood :

I can say, for exemple : Grey (DS) > Mirajane > Natsu (Dual Mode) = Grey (DS) = Gajeel (Dual Mode).
Grey beeing below Mirajane in stats and close to his rivals, but with Magic giving far higher damages to Mira than Natsu and Gajeel. (This is where my exemple with "Shazam vs Superman" point about).

It's like Vs Zirconis : Wendy could hurt him with her Slaying Magic, where Sitri couldn't hurt him. We all know Mirajane >> Wendy but vs Zirconis, Wendy >Mirajane in damage.

Skullion can be > Grey with Mira = Skullion but with Grey > Skullion vs Mira. (More Dangerous).

Am I clear ?

 

[bugen]

Agree but we have to take account circumstances in battles.

For me, it's clear that Mirajane gave her all vs Skullion to a withsdraw (she said to Elfman they could loose the battle if they continued).
Today, Skullion is a wall for both Mirajane and Grey. So I still put them at same rate.

But if in a revenge battle, Grey manages to win by himself without external help (element or person), then I will see him as the guy who break this wall.
So I will not see him at Mirajane's level like currently, but above.

In close future, I can see Grey teaming up with Gajeel vs Skullion and Mardmole (I really hope this team-up). If FT wins, I will see this team above Mira's.

Like I said, it's not about stats here but effectivities and this is where I am misunderstood :

I can say, for exemple : Grey (DS) > Mirajane > Natsu (Dual Mode) = Grey (DS) = Gajeel (Dual Mode).
Grey beeing below in stats and close to his rivals who are below Mirajane, but with Magic giving far higher damages to Mira than Natsu and Gajeel. (This is where my exemple with "Shazam vs Superman" point about).

It's like Vs Zirconis : Wendy could hurt him with her Slaying Magic, where Sitri couldn't hurt him. We all know Mirajane >> Wendy but vs Zirconis, Wendy >Mirajane in damage.

Skullion can be > Grey with Mira = Skullion but with Grey > Skullion vs Mira. (More Dangerous).

Am I clear ?

Exactly, things depend on which character faces, for example Gray has a certain advantage over Mirajane as she is a "demon" and Gray is a Devil Slayer.

 

[Ronin31]

Exactly, things depend on which character faces, for example Gray has a certain advantage over Mirajane as she is a "demon" and Gray is a Devil Slayer.

Yes, that's it. Thank you.

And I don't think the gap in power and stats between current Grey and Mirajane are more important than Grey and Mard Geer in Tartaros.
Mard Geer was stronger than 3 DS combine in human form while playing and feared Grey to the point he went Etherious form and used Memento Mori, spell created to erase Zeref.

Grey was far below in stats they are not even comparable but could hurt him close to the death. He was even stronger than Dragon Force Natsu who dealt medium damage.

How is it possible to see DS Grey full power < 50% Mirajane ? That's a no sense for me. Is 100% Mirajane 10x stronger than Grey in stats without Slayer advantage, or Gajeel as exemple ? Mirajane is not Acnologia who played with 7 DS .

 

[AmitDS]

-Gray said battling Mira would be tough
-Gray agreed that his DeS freezing would fail against her like Skullion
-Gray thought that Mira was strong enough to beat Skullion
-Gray said he expected to wait for Mira to be quite injured before he fought her
-Gray agreed that he struggled to beat heavily injured Mira
-Juvia said he gave it his all
- Gray used DeS magic on Demon Freed to hurt him
-Mirajane tied with Skullion in her weakest form
-Sitri and Alegria are literally stated to be stronger than BSS
-Elfman her clear inferior drew with Madmole
- Natsu thought Mira would be in the center as the strongest would be there after fighting ISDM Gajeel at the right.
-Erza tied with Laxus
-Skullion beat Gray easily

This is more than enough to know that Skullion, Erza and yes Mira are very much stronger than Gray. I love how stating the fact that Mira is stronger than Gray is somehow seen as bashing Gray. Telling.

Only because this is Mira and this upsets fan power scaling headcanons that this is even up for debate and everyone acts as though everyone's opinion is equal. It is not.

And funny thing is, Gray himself said she has no weakness (he's a devil slayer) and he uses the power of a demon while Mirajane's takeover magic lets her takeover the power of demons. Yet people act like their power interaction is confirmed to be Gray's > Mira's.

Skullion is no wall for Mira anymore than she is a wall for him. Mira is not suffering from the same treatment and loss as Gray. Mira didn't lose to him. Gray did. Gray is the only one on Team Natsu who didn't win a rematch with his DE thus far. It's not that hard.

You'd think you guys would have learned your lesson after prematurely celebrating Gray surpassing Mira and even Erza and Laxus (lol), only for Mashima in 100 years quest to humble you, but alas...

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 31, 2021, Original Post Date: Oct 31, 2021 ---

Not at all. I don't want to save anyone, neither Grey, neither Mirajane. I respect both in characters and their powers.
You don't.

I don't because I state the truth that Mira is stronger based on feats and hype currently? Like it or not you kinda are trying to 'save' him.

Yes, and I said that previously, just like Natsu did vs Gajeel. Neither used their trump cards in their respective fights.
I also said that Mira had support and Elfman is also a tough one.

You saw Natsu vs Gajeel. You didn't see Gray vs Mira so you have to go with what's stated i.e. he did his best/gave it his all. You also saw him use DeS to harm Freed when he was demonized and saw Mirajane tie with Skullion when Skullion low diffed DeS Gray. Speaking of Natsu he himself supported that Mira, Laxus & Jellal > Gajeel so...

Lucy said Elfman was here too but Mirajane's overhype shadows him as a comic scene since the beginning of the dialogue.
Or tell me, who defeats Elfman when the girls run away in different places to take Gajeel and Makarov in the cards while he was fighting ?

And Gray and Cana said it was Mira who he struggled with. This is the 100th time I pointed this out to you yet you keep ignoring it. Funny.

Sorry, you are omniscient and I can't have idea and point of view. Apologies.
- Natsu used Dragon Force vs Gajeel, for sure. I haven't seen it.
- Grey used Devil Slayer vs Mirajane, for sure. I haven't seen it.

You did see Gray agree with Cana's claim that his DeS freezing would fail on Mira though so...

Yes, fighting a friend is not an handicap.

She is a friend, not a Mard Geer or END. Nevermind how powerful she is.

Funny how he used devil slaying magic on his friend Freed when Freed was a demon though...

Mirajane is too strong to be beaten in his regular mode and has risk to be too much injured with DS Magic while being previously weakened.
Struggling is fair here against 2 weakened opponents while removing deadly moves.

Meanwhile in canon:
-Gray says she has no weakness then saw her weakness was family
-Lucy says she has no weakness but family
-Gray agreed that his DeS freezing which he used on Skullion would fail against her.
-We don't know how demon takeover magic interacts with devil slaying magic.

If you knows DC Universe, it's like Shazam (Captain Marvel) vs Superman : Shazam will have hard time taking down Superman in physicals as they are close one and even can be beaten here. If Shazam uses his Magic inside his physicals, he can two shots him due to Superman's weaknesses to Magic.
Is it hard to understand ?

Irrelevant to FT and Mashima's story where Gray has stated that Mira has no weakness, his DeS freezing would fail on her, she'd be tough and has used DeS magic on other demon friends like Freed.

It's not about stats here, but weaknesses : Mirajane takes over demons,

And Gray uses the power of a demon for his magic.
Aaaaand Gray still stated that she would be tough, he can't freeze her with DeS, she has no weakness.
So you actually don't know the extent to which she is weak to his magic, if at all.

Yes, again, you are omniscient. Apologies.

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 31, 2021, Original Post Date: Oct 31, 2021 ---

I forgive you.

So, why didn't she use her strongest forms to destroy Skullion and Mardmole if she is so above ??
She said she couldn't defeat Skullion so she did her best against him.

So are you saying that Alegria and Sitri are not stronger than BSS; Armadura is not stronger than Heavens Wheel; DeS is not stronger than normal Gray etc.?

Unless you have proof that Sitri and Alegria are not stronger, I don't see why I am burdened with answering this nor why this is used as proof of something. Erza said that Sitri was Mira's strongest satan soul at the time of the GMG and in the final arc Mira said that Alegria was her trump card. I could say she failed to use other forms because they consume a lot of magic or it's PIS but again, I am not in any position to decide what is canon fact. Neither are you. DeS is Gray's trump card, BSS and Skullion in his normal form (outside of DF) are not their peak forms.

 

[IamtherealMirajane]

Im really not sure why it became a Gray vs. Mira all of a sudden.lol.

Just to add on what @AmitDS has stated already.

Unlike the God Slayer we know so far, Devil Slaying is a magic of a "demon" to slay or exorcise a demon. Thats why too much consuming it will lead to "demonize" the user. And it has been stated in the manga that Silver has his demon form but was not seen. There are 3 users of DeS so far in the series (Silver, Gray and Bloodman). As far is God Slayer is concerned no one has the ability to transform to take a god form. or what ever you called it unlike the devil slayer, who can use a demonize form and Dragon Slayer, who can use dragonize form.


Now Unlike God Take Over so far in the series vs Demon Take Over. The latter has shown that it can control, manipulate, or take over partially or full any demon alike including curses, according do its bidding and has superiority on it. While the former, Dimaria, was chosen as a vessels by the God Chronos. There is a possibility that since DeS is demon power Mira might take over it.


Now lets go back to the manga. It has been stated by couple of characters already that MIRAJANE has no weaknesses that someone can exploited against her. Because if there is. It will be outright stated in the manga. Yes including Devil Slaying. Remember that Cana and even Gray admitted that freezing her using his DeS (the one he used against Skullion) will not work against Mira. And we have Lucy who is arguably one of the smartest in the Guild does not recognize that Mira has weaknessess. Or else she will just say outright that if only if she has Gray on her side due to his devil slaying abilities or if she has gray DeS abilities. it will be easy to eliminate Mira. But nope... thats not the case.

And why there is risk using DeS against Mira but not with Freed, who also use a demon power lol and way weaker than Mira. I just dont see the point here. Did Freed died because Gray used it against him? The answer is no.

I also dont believe that Gray, also fought with Elfman. Since he only Mentioned that he will fight Mira because she is too injured and it would be easy to knock her out. Then the question who Fought Elfman ? there is Cana and Lucy. What would they do there ? Remember that Elfman is already out of his take over form maybe because he runs out magic. I doubt he can handle another starmix dress attack from lucy or Fairy glitter from Cana and it will only take a minute or less to knock him using the 2 power, or else Gray will say it to save his face the reason he struggled because he fought
the two siblings alone. But nope he only stated Mira. Even Juvia has said that Gray gave his all.

Now why Mira didnt use her trump card Or
stronger form against Skullion and Madmole. I think it is more of strategic move. To gauge their capabilities.
Since She already learned her lessons. Lol. Remember when she used it against Juliet and Heine. Someone stronger appeared after she wasted her magic. Remember the stronger the form. The more it consumes a lot of magic especially, the Alegria form. She can only use it as finisher. and another thing there is Elfman. Remember if someone is close to her she dont gave her 100 % Because she is tired being a called a monster or far worse. Or just simply Mashima wants to conclude the fight already.

 

[AmitDS]

Im really not sure why it became a Gray vs. Mira all of a sudden.lol.

Just to add on what @AmitDS has stated already.

Unlike the God Slayer we know so far, Devil Slaying is a magic of a "demon" to slay or exorcise a demon. Thats why too much consuming it will lead to "demonize" the user. And it has been stated in the manga that Silver has his demon form but was not seen. There are 3 users of DeS so far in the series (Silver, Gray and Bloodman). As far is God Slayer is concerned no one has the ability to transform to take a god form. or what ever you called it unlike the devil slayer, who can use a demonize form and Dragon Slayer, who can use dragonize form.


Now Unlike God Take Over so far in the series vs Demon Take Over. The latter has shown that it can control, manipulate, or take over partially or full any demon alike including curses, according do its bidding and has superiority on it. While the former, Dimaria, was chosen as a vessels by the God Chronos. There is a possibility that since DeS is demon power Mira might take over it.


Now lets go back to the manga. It has been stated by couple of characters already that MIRAJANE has no weaknesses that someone can exploited against her. Because if there is. It will be outright stated in the manga. Yes including Devil Slaying. Remember that Cana and even Gray admitted that freezing her using his DeS (the one he used against Skullion) will not work against Mira. And we have Lucy who is arguably one of the smartest in the Guild does not recognize that Mira has weaknessess. Or else she will just say outright that if only if she has Gray on her side due to his devil slaying abilities or if she has gray DeS abilities. it will be easy to eliminate Mira. But nope... thats not the case.

And why there is risk using DeS against Mira but not with Freed, who also use a demon power lol and way weaker than Mira. I just dont see the point here. Did Freed died because Gray used it against him? The answer is no.

I also dont believe that Gray, also fought with Elfman. Since he only Mentioned that he will fight Mira because she is too injured and it would be easy to knock her out. Then the question who Fought Elfman ? there is Cana and Lucy. What would they do there ? Remember that Elfman is already out of his take over form maybe because he runs out magic. I doubt he can handle another starmix dress attack from lucy or Fairy glitter from Cana and it will only take a minute or less to knock him using the 2 power, or else Gray will say it to save his face the reason he struggled because he fought
the two siblings alone. But nope he only stated Mira. Even Juvia has said that Gray gave his all.

Now why Mira didnt use her trump card Or
stronger form against Skullion and Madmole. I think it is more of strategic move. To gauge their capabilities.
Since She already learned her lessons. Lol. Remember when she used it against Juliet and Heine. Someone stronger appeared after she wasted her magic. Remember the stronger the form. The more it consumes a lot of magic especially, the Alegria form. She can only use it as finisher. and another thing there is Elfman. Remember if someone is close to her she dont gave her 100 % Because she is tired being a called a monster or far worse. Or just simply Mashima wants to conclude the fight already.

It apparently became about Gray and Mira because people got mad about me saying that Skullion = BSS Mira so if those 2 can low diff him, Erza does at least that. Who told me to mention Mira? Lol all hell broke lose and we got thrust back to 2020 when this was controversial for some reason.

 

[Seven777]

Kyria low diffed Erza too, let's get real. Gray will have his rematch and like Erza he'll probably win.

 

[AmitDS]

Erza was matching Kyria without any armor and using 1-2 regular swords then Kyria had to resort to hax. In the rematch Kyria broke Benizakura but Erza beat her with flame empress armor and her belserion sword. Gray went all out with 2/4 of his DeS spells and lost to Skullion who is stronger than Kyria and Madmole, and Gray is still without a win while Erza and Natsu got their revenge within 1-2 chapters of 'losing'. And since when do future powerups/performances dictate current standings?
Feats and hype currently have Erza and Skullion comfortably above Gray, and Madmole and Kyria significantly below Erza so...on the topic of this thread Erza can logically, possibly low diff Gray since Skullion did it and Gray struggled with a beat up Mirajane off panel. Not my fault Mashima didn't make Gray Laxus leveled after the final arc, like everyone wanted lol.

 

[Sevently]

Gray is never beating Erza, and was never stronger than her.