Semifinal 1: Whitebeard vs. Gol D. Roger

[leshrak]

It's impossible to know who is stronger here as Oda himself said so many times that they draw. Sure Roger was te Pirate King, however WB himself said to Roger that he didn't want the title (I don't remember the chapter, they were on an island talking, Roger offered to tell WB where the One Piece was and WB refused) so I'm not using the title as a way to decide the winner.
I'll vote WB for two reasons. One, he was the last survivor. Even if Roger didn't surrender to the Marines, he would have died before WB because of his disease. Second, because if Roger wins hhere, there'll be no discussion next round as he won against WB based on is title not is fighting abilities, which we never saw.

 

[Fixit]

My vote's gotta be for whitey... since some guys are saying Roger wins this cuz he was the king , I'll say he already lost to the executioners

 

[redhairSH]

They fought to a draw in the past, but roger was sick in the past, and if a sick roger can tie healthy whitebeard, i'll give it to roger

 

[Cyrs]

My vote's gotta be for whitey... since some guys are saying Roger wins this cuz he was the king , I'll say he already lost to the executioners

By that logic, Whitebeard already lost to Blackbeard, haha.

I'll go with Roger, since by tournament rules, we go by the character as we last saw them.
We saw Roger in his prime, but Whitebeard as old and sick (and as Marco said, not evading attacks he used to be able to).
So if they used to be on par, then the rules dictate Roger wins.

... But it's not like people have actually been voting based off the rules... just voting however they want, haha. *shrug*

---------- Post added at 12:51 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:49 PM ----------

They fought to a draw in the past, but roger was sick in the past, and if a sick roger can tie healthy whitebeard, i'll give it to roger

Also, good catch. Roger wasn't even in his prime, he was sick. And still tied with a healthy, in-his-prime Whitebeard.

 

[Razh]

Also, good catch. Roger wasn't even in his prime, he was sick. And still tied with a healthy, in-his-prime Whitebeard.

Roger wasn't sick during his entire pirating career. Only last couple of years.

 

[Cyrs]

Roger wasn't sick during his entire pirating career. Only last couple of years.

That's the same time he was in the New World, and had his fights with Whitebeard.

 

[Zehahaha]

WB for me, showed feats and stuff

 

[Razh]

That's the same time he was in the New World, and had his fights with Whitebeard.

Correct me if I'm wrong but Oda never gave a precise timeline of Roger's voyages through the world. He was sick during his last 2 or 3 years (I can't remember which) when Crocus was with them. He was practically a kid when we saw him recruit Rayleigh. He was probably around Whitebeard's age so it would mean he was around 50 when he was executed.
It leaves plenty of time for skirmishes with Whitebeard. Nobody ever said Whitebeard was born in New World and never left it. They could have fought in several places. Besides, it's not like it took Roger 30 years to get to New World. That's a little too much.

Anyway, it all boils down to Roger starting his pirating career as a kid and ending around his fifties. Which means he was perfectly fine most of his life and we have no reason to think that any kind of illness made him weaker in his fights with Whitebeard.

 

[Cyrs]

Correct me if I'm wrong but Oda never gave a precise timeline of Roger's voyages through the world. He was sick during his last 2 or 3 years (I can't remember which) when Crocus was with them. He was practically a kid when we saw him recruit Rayleigh. He was probably around Whitebeard's age so it would mean he was around 50 when he was executed.
It leaves plenty of time for skirmishes with Whitebeard. Nobody ever said Whitebeard was born in New World and never left it. They could have fought in several places. Besides, it's not like it took Roger 30 years to get to New World. That's a little too much.

Anyway, it all boils down to Roger starting his pirating career as a kid and ending around his fifties. Which means he was perfectly fine most of his life and we have no reason to think that any kind of illness made him weaker in his fights with Whitebeard.

Crocus joined them at the beginning of the Grand Line. So unless Roger and Whitebeard never clashed anywhere in the Grand Line, either the first half or the New World, then the reasoning stands.

 

[Razh]

Crocus joined them at the beginning of the Grand Line. So unless Roger and Whitebeard never clashed anywhere in the Grand Line, either the first half or the New World, then the reasoning stands.

Yes, but once you sail through the entire Grand Line, you return back to the start.

 

[Cyrs]

Yes, but once you sail through the entire Grand Line, you return back to the start.

Hahaha. Actually, we have no idea what happens to you. Maybe you come up out from inside Reverse Mountain, get shot up in the air, and land in some random place on the globe. Who knows.

Crocus joined when the Roger pirates began their adventure on the Grand Line.

---

Anyway, when this tournament began, I assumed Whitebeard would win the votes.

Personally, I think it would be a shame for the undefeated Pirate King not to win.

 

[Fixit]

Geez, lets finish this tournament already, Roger is the winner by the solo fact he was the king

 

[Akainu]

This is a tournament of individuals. Roger became pirateking, but he didn't do that alone, he had a crew, friends, family etc., not to mention the circumstances - we still don't know what it takes to get to Raftel - and whatever else played into that like knowledge - will of D., lost century - and so forth.

Or in short: wait how people vote

 

[Mr. Arashi]

This is a tournament of individuals. Roger became pirateking, but he didn't do that alone, he had a crew, friends, family etc., not to mention the circumstances - we still don't know what it takes to get to Raftel - and whatever else played into that like knowledge - will of D., lost century - and so forth.

Or in short: wait how people vote

You could have said that in the previous Roger battles.

 

[Josear XIII]

i can see shanks winning this tournament I'll vote for white beard since someone must have surpassed Gol. D at some point in OP universe and i think this man was the one in his prime

 

[RezzieThaRapper]

Please, for the love of God, vote for Whitebeard.
Yes, Roger is the Pirate King, but we have no idea about his ability.

We CANNOT have a guy we don't know winning the tournament!!!

I'm glad this tournament happened, but it should have been tier'd up... and no feat characters like Roger/Dragon/ect. would not be used, and it could've been more fun... I knew from the beginning it would with no doubt be one of these two winning...

WB has my vote... because Gold Roger has no feats and I'd have him lose against Don Krieg if it came to it... sure Roger's the Pirate King but it doesn't mean much in this tournament in which he has no feats other than holding a pistol and sword and screaming at Shiki...

 

[Cyrs]

This is a tournament of individuals. Roger became pirateking, but he didn't do that alone, he had a crew, friends, family etc., not to mention the circumstances - we still don't know what it takes to get to Raftel - and whatever else played into that like knowledge - will of D., lost century - and so forth.

Or in short: wait how people vote

True, but of course Roger did it with a much, much smaller group of people than any of his rivals had. I mean, look how many pirates Whitebeard had! Shiki had a whole armada too. Garp and Sengoku often went together, along with Marine warships. So if anything, it speaks to the individual power of each crew member, and Roger for being the boss of such monsters.

 

[mugiwara4343]

My vote goes for Whitebeard. Roger X Whitebeard had an epic battle sometime in the past and I remember it being tied and we have seen some kickass abilities/powers of Whitebeard in ace execution war saga and we had only heard about Roger. So my vote goes to Whitebeard

 

[Akainu]

True, but of course Roger did it with a much, much smaller group of people than any of his rivals had. I mean, look how many pirates Whitebeard had! Shiki had a whole armada too. Garp and Sengoku often went together, along with Marine warships. So if anything, it speaks to the individual power of each crew member, and Roger for being the boss of such monsters.

In direct fights between two whole groups, I would agree that the smaller one has more powerful individuals. However, we do not know about the way to Raftel / becoming pirateking yet, so it might as well be easier for smaller groups. On the other hand, Garp and Sengoku represent the Marines, the military/police of the Worldgovernment (as far as we know) so they naturally need bigger groups. Shiki, afair, was plotting to topple the Worldgovernment, which is a diffrent task as well and similarly Whitebeard settled down as Yonkou for which he needed a big crew (do we actually know his crews size in the days of fighting Roger?).
So altogether, their groups rather follow the function they have in the manga and we can't necessarily derive their strength from that. Interestingly, Luffy took on the role of protecting FI which doesn't really fit the crew's size, but that's another discussion.

tl;dr: neither title nor the size of the combatants crew help us decide this match. follow your heart?

 

[RichardMNixon]

Whitebeard settled down as Yonkou for which he needed a big crew (do we actually know his crews size in the days of fighting Roger?).

Whitebeard's goal was to have a family, so the size of his crew was an end in and of itself, not something he needed for a secondary goal or for power.

I also think territory is less about having someone stationed there to actively defend it and more about the threat of reprisal if you mess with it.