Question What do you think Vegapunk is announcing to the world?

[kkck]

I feel like the tech angle wouldn't really move the story that much as far as reveals go. If this is something that is supposed to jumpstart a worldwide revolution then it has to be something that gets a big chunk of the population up in arms. Looking at vegapunk's backstory where he has been involved so far is:

- He appeared at ohara and witness the giants with the saved history.
- He joined with a few others to start MADS.
- He met the gorosei and started working with and for the government
- Used his position to research ancient technology and the lost history

I feel like even revealing ancient technology existed or even the name of the ancient kingdom wouldn't really shuffle the board all that much. Most people in the world are just normal people who are mostly unanffected by the fate of the ancient kingdom 800 years ago. So my guess is that vegapunk will talk about the following, if briefly:

The truth of what happened in ohara, without government propaganda.
The true identity of the gorosei.

These two would actually poke at wounds people have. It'd be visceral. Vegapunk would tell the population that what is happening at ohara and egghead was unjustified and reprehensible. Which would in context also apply to egghead. And that it can happen to anyone.

And he would reveal the gorosei are immortal evil beings that rule over the world with the reverie being merely a formality to deal with minor concerns of measly mortals.

I suppose the final bit worth noting is not only what vegapunk will say but what he can show people. His transmision has an image after all. maybe he will show the world a sun type thing for energy? Its relevance would be more on the freedom angle than the tech angle though. Maybe vegapunk has recorded conversations with the gorosei...

 

[Vanshrimp]

now we know for sure the message or truth, it is not some revelation as "plain text", but a revelation with evidences, otherwise what is the point of asking for screens. Way i see it, VP is going to show some experiment he did with results, to proof the existence of something related to some tabu.

 

[RaisinRisin]

What will incite people to anger?
- Good question. It will be that the Celestial Dragons are NOT Gods. They will learn that the World Government invaded God's people to establish their rule over the world.

Lunarians used to be known as a tribe of "gods" while they dwelled on top of the Red Line. According to Whitebeard, there used to exist a "Kingdom of Gods" (神の国, Kami no Kuni?) on the red continent long before Mary Geoise was ever there.

I meant anger against the World Government, whose authority most people currently accept. Many average people already hate the Celestial Dragons. I doubt anyone thinks of CDs as gods. If people actually saw them that way, Doflamingo's family would have been put up on a pedestal and worshipped, rather than publicly shamed and attacked as scapegoats.

Yes, it's worth noticing the current WG took the Lunarians' place on top of the Red Line. Whatever surviving Lunarians exist, I expect they'll either help Luffy (like Alber might have if he knew he was the new Joyboy), or they'll stand on the sidelines out of bitterness and need to be convinced to join one side or the other.

I feel like even revealing ancient technology existed or even the name of the ancient kingdom wouldn't really shuffle the board all that much. Most people in the world are just normal people who are mostly unanffected by the fate of the ancient kingdom 800 years ago. So my guess is that vegapunk will talk about the following, if briefly:

The truth of what happened in ohara, without government propaganda.
The true identity of the gorosei.

These two would actually poke at wounds people have. It'd be visceral. Vegapunk would tell the population that what is happening at ohara and egghead was unjustified and reprehensible. Which would in context also apply to egghead. And that it can happen to anyone.

And he would reveal the gorosei are immortal evil beings that rule over the world with the reverie being merely a formality to deal with minor concerns of measly mortals.

I suppose the final bit worth noting is not only what vegapunk will say but what he can show people. His transmision has an image after all. maybe he will show the world a sun type thing for energy? Its relevance would be more on the freedom angle than the tech angle though. Maybe vegapunk has recorded conversations with the gorosei...

Interesting. I agree most people wouldn't care about the tech angle in general, but I hold up the potential for abundant energy as an exception for a couple of reasons:

1. Thematically, Vegapunk is known as the man who lit up the world and loved for it so much that this is even repeated in this latest chapter.
2. VP also pointed out in a previous chapter how wars are even fought over fuel sources.

That being said, I fully realize Luffy himself (+ probably people who live in places either with reliable energy or who are used to living without it) probably wouldn't even care about even the energy thing in and of itself. So speaking for myself, I absolutely do expect there to be more to the broadcast than just "They're holding back free energy to control you."

Obviously something more sinister has to be revealed about the Gorousei themselves, if not all Celestial Dragons... but why would their identity matter unless it's intricately connected with some kind of grave injustice, particularly one that continues to be a threat in the present day?

What should truly turn people against them (and would definitely make Luffy see them as his enemy #1) is something we know already-- that they are nation destroyers. In particular, in chapter 908 the Gandhi-resembling Elder says the time has come for a "great cleansing" (as TCB has it), right before all of the Elders ask Imu what "light" to erase from the world. and then in chapter 1086 Imu decides on Lulusia before they even know Sabo is going there.

Someone said in this thread or the 1108 one that Vegapunk might make an apology. They might be right if he's apologizing for creating the Mother Flame.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 1, 2024, Original Post Date: Mar 1, 2024 ---

now we know for sure the message or truth, it is not some revelation as "plain text", but a revelation with evidences, otherwise what is the point of asking for screens. Way i see it, VP is going to show some experiment he did with results, to proof the existence of something related to some tabu.

Or he could just show images from the lost history of the Void Century, copied right out of books saved from Ohara.

 

[kkck]

Interesting. I agree most people wouldn't care about the tech angle in general, but I hold up the potential for abundant energy as an exception for a couple of reasons:

1. Thematically, Vegapunk is known as the man who lit up the world and loved for it so much that this is even repeated in this latest chapter.
2. VP also pointed out in a previous chapter how wars are even fought over fuel sources.

That being said, I fully realize Luffy himself (+ probably people who live in places either with reliable energy or who are used to living without it) probably wouldn't even care about even the energy thing in and of itself. So speaking for myself, I absolutely do expect there to be more to the broadcast than just "They're holding back free energy to control you."

Obviously something more sinister has to be revealed about the Gorousei themselves, if not all Celestial Dragons... but why would their identity matter unless it's intricately connected with some kind of grave injustice, particularly one that continues to be a threat in the present day?

What should truly turn people against them (and would definitely make Luffy see them as his enemy #1) is something we know already-- that they are nation destroyers. In particular, in chapter 908 the Gandhi-resembling Elder says the time has come for a "great cleansing" (as TCB has it), right before all of the Elders ask Imu what "light" to erase from the world. and then in chapter 1086 Imu decides on Lulusia before they even know Sabo is going there.

Someone said in this thread or the 1108 one that Vegapunk might make an apology. They might be right if he's apologizing for creating the Mother Flame.

As far as I can tell most people in OP live relatively low tech lifestyles. I don't see how the infinite energy stuff would mean much of anything for the masses of dressrosa or alabasta. Obviously folk still use and need energy and resources for a variety of things but it's a bit of a reach that most of them would see a benefit to vegapunk's high tech stuff. How useful would nuclear power be to medieval farmers?

Oh, that's an interesting bit. Maybe vegapunk will reveal that he built the motherflame, that he gave it to the gorosei and they used it to erase lulusia. Can't believe I forgot about that when I was writing my post about vegapunk's history.

 

[RaisinRisin]

As far as I can tell most people in OP live relatively low tech lifestyles. I don't see how the infinite energy stuff would mean much of anything for the masses of dressrosa or alabasta. Obviously folk still use and need energy and resources for a variety of things but it's a bit of a reach that most of them would see a benefit to vegapunk's high tech stuff. How useful would nuclear power be to medieval farmers?

Oh, that's an interesting bit. Maybe vegapunk will reveal that he built the motherflame, that he gave it to the gorosei and they used it to erase lulusia. Can't believe I forgot about that when I was writing my post about vegapunk's history.

They do, but I'm not talking anything requiring a computer here; just basic electricity, simple motors (e.g. instead of secret hidden slaves for that moving sidewalk), etc. If their fuel source is non-renewable, and nations like Dressrosa are discovered to have a lot of that resource, they could be attacked or even mislead and exploited like the people of Law's homeland or like how Alabasta was already manipulated over rainwater. Actually I exempted nations with reliable energy above, but they'd also be prime targets that probably hire Germa forces to fight each other.

Lore aside, I think most importantly, something has to either directly provoke Luffy to feel antagonized by the WG now or something about this clash with the Gorousei will have to start to provoke sentiments that cause Luffy to want to take them down at some point (as opposed to seeing them as a one-time enemy that he had to deal with in passing but can ignore, going forward).

 

[VioletVector]

I meant anger against the World Government, whose authority most people currently accept. Many average people already hate the Celestial Dragons. I doubt anyone thinks of CDs as gods. If people actually saw them that way, Doflamingo's family would have been put up on a pedestal and worshipped, rather than publicly shamed and attacked as scapegoats.

Yes, it's worth noticing the current WG took the Lunarians' place on top of the Red Line. Whatever surviving Lunarians exist, I expect they'll either help Luffy (like Alber might have if he knew he was the new Joyboy), or they'll stand on the sidelines out of bitterness and need to be convinced to join one side or the other.



Interesting. I agree most people wouldn't care about the tech angle in general, but I hold up the potential for abundant energy as an exception for a couple of reasons:

1. Thematically, Vegapunk is known as the man who lit up the world and loved for it so much that this is even repeated in this latest chapter.
2. VP also pointed out in a previous chapter how wars are even fought over fuel sources.

That being said, I fully realize Luffy himself (+ probably people who live in places either with reliable energy or who are used to living without it) probably wouldn't even care about even the energy thing in and of itself. So speaking for myself, I absolutely do expect there to be more to the broadcast than just "They're holding back free energy to control you."

Obviously something more sinister has to be revealed about the Gorousei themselves, if not all Celestial Dragons... but why would their identity matter unless it's intricately connected with some kind of grave injustice, particularly one that continues to be a threat in the present day?

What should truly turn people against them (and would definitely make Luffy see them as his enemy #1) is something we know already-- that they are nation destroyers. In particular, in chapter 908 the Gandhi-resembling Elder says the time has come for a "great cleansing" (as TCB has it), right before all of the Elders ask Imu what "light" to erase from the world. and then in chapter 1086 Imu decides on Lulusia before they even know Sabo is going there.

Someone said in this thread or the 1108 one that Vegapunk might make an apology. They might be right if he's apologizing for creating the Mother Flame.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 1, 2024, Original Post Date: Mar 1, 2024 ---

Or he could just show images from the lost history of the Void Century, copied right out of books saved from Ohara.

Doflamingo's family were vulnerable outcasts.

Everyone knows you bow down to the Celestial Dragons or something bad happens to you. The reason Doflamingo's family was treated badly is because they tried to live among humans. .

 

[RaisinRisin]

Doflamingo's family were vulnerable outcasts.

Everyone knows you bow down to the Celestial Dragons or something bad happens to you. The reason Doflamingo's family was treated badly is because they tried to live among humans. .

People bow down because of the repercussions of not doing so, not because of beliefs in the actual divinity of Celestial Dragons. Doffy's family was scapegoated for past actions of CDs who are probably still CDs and very likely have nothing to do with Doffy's immediate family at that point in time. If you don't believe me, look it up for yourself.

 

[Vanshrimp]

i think part of his revelation could explain the hole near water 7 and the hole left after lulusia...

 

[RaisinRisin]

i think part of his revelation could explain the hole near water 7 and the hole left after lulusia...

Could be. Multiple nations other than the Ancient (Giant) one were likely destroyed. There's also definitely been some kind of restructuring of the physical state of the world that happened at some point. This could be a good time for the story to touch on those possibilities.

 

[RaisinRisin]

Congrats to the two "we'll cut to some other scenario" voters, that's the closest answer to what actually happened even if the "other scenario" was still on Egghead. From 1108 it only(?) took 5 chapters + a 3 week break.

I suppose it's still possible they'll cut away to some other situation or a flashback, but with so much going on, I'd be really surprised at this point.

 

[Fox666]

So speaking for myself, I absolutely do expect there to be more to the broadcast than just "They're holding back free energy to control you."

I think it would be more like "The world used to be 500 years more advanced, but the WG took everything away so people would be easier to control"

What should truly turn people against them (and would definitely make Luffy see them as his enemy #1) is something we know already-- that they are nation destroyers. In particular, in chapter 908 the Gandhi-resembling Elder says the time has come for a "great cleansing" (as TCB has it), right before all of the Elders ask Imu what "light" to erase from the world. and then in chapter 1086 Imu decides on Lulusia before they even know Sabo is going there.

The WG sinking the entire world but the Celestial Dragons living atop the Red Line would fill in the requirements

Someone said in this thread or the 1108 one that Vegapunk might make an apology. They might be right if he's apologizing for creating the Mother Flame.

I don't think Vegapunk's "sins" would be something he discovered recently one of his Satellites did... Sounds like something he had in his mind for a while.

Is it what he did to Kuma? Cloning? Human weapons?

 

[RaisinRisin]

The WG sinking the entire world but the Celestial Dragons living atop the Red Line would fill in the requirements

It would, but I'm waiting on why the world is sinking. It might not be because of them.

I wouldn't be surprised if the Great Kingdom's scientists were a lot like Vegapunk and they went too far for the love of science, causing (or nearly causing) the sinking phenomenon.

I wasn't a fan of the idea they intentionally engineered devil fruit in the Great Kingdom, but I have to admit if they did, it fits up with something Oda said about how areas where the OP world violate our concept of reality are almost exclusively due to devil fruit. He's also hinted there weren't originally giants in the OP world, meaning something would have had to cause them to appear. (The Dawn & Dusk channel on Youtube has an interesting theory about "pyrobloin" in clouds, and even points out almost every time G5 Luffy went fully into giant form, he's seen passing through clouds first, with one exception that might have had the pyrobloin come from a source other than clouds.)

If much like Punk Hazard's climate, all of the oddities of their world were the result of rampant, unconstrained science experiments (like, say, detaching continents so they can be pulled around by a "continent puller"), it could explain a lot.

I don't think Vegapunk's "sins" would be something he discovered recently one of his Satellites did... Sounds like something he had in his mind for a while.

Is it what he did to Kuma? Cloning? Human weapons?

Yup, I said that before we even saw York and Stella use the term "sins." I still think VP genuinely has a lot to apologize for... BUT the only thing I think he would apologize for is the WG's use of the Mother Flame. Thing is, since the time I posted that, I've realized York must have kept it secret that she gave the Mother Flame to the WG. While I do think he should apologize, I don't think that's what he'll do in the broadcast.

Right now I'm leaning more toward an explanation of the sinking world, with a possible tie-in to the Great Kingdom (whether they are or aren't responsible for the sinking phenomenon). Maybe also what the deal is with the Red Line, since it's probably related... but I still think there's room for talk of an infinite energy source. There's also a chance he might say something to help the Revolutionaries (since the broadcast is set to go out when his heart stops) and I'd like to see him say something that really does weaken the public's trust in the WG and absolves the Straw Hats of blame, though right now I'm not sure what it will be if he doesn't know about how Lulusia (and probably Enies Lobby) happened.

*edited to fix something I apparently forgot after reading the raw and was reminded of while reading TCB's translation
(specifically, VP has already said not to blame the ones who killed him so that will help if the SHes are implicated by the WG &/or Morgans).

 

[DeadlyBeast]

Congrats to the two "we'll cut to some other scenario" voters, that's the closest answer to what actually happened even if the "other scenario" was still on Egghead. From 1108 it only(?) took 5 chapters + a 3 week break.

I suppose it's still possible they'll cut away to some other situation or a flashback, but with so much going on, I'd be really surprised at this point.

Thank you. I went for the answer that represented an unpleasant route that would leave me unsatisfied yet wanting more.

 

[RaisinRisin]

So we've got another break/hiatus on our hands.

After being reminded with the latest anime ep that Vegapunk doesn't want to explicitly rebel against the WG directly (leaving aside he kinda has already, lol), I've been thinking that he will not intentionally accuse the WG of anything. But it's still likely he's going to say things that indirectly cause them trouble. Even just the panic over the world ending could escalate if Imu doesn't want to do anything about it. (I can see there being just enough places left to grow food and they can breed as many slaves as they want in Mary Geoise, so they could use it to "reset" the world, from Imu's perspective.)

So it's possible things could get more serious, or they could get very silly. If we're not letting our expectations rise too high, it could even go something like this...

VP: If I only had access to the advanced energy source of the Great Kingdom [name], we could have infinite energy to make all islands float!
**Globally, people collectively tilt their heads wondering what he's talking about while the Gorousei freak out.**
Shaka (*facepalming*): Stella, maybe we shouldn't talk about history...
VP: "Oops! I shouldn't talk about the Void Century, but humanity would sure be more likely to survive with a free and infinite energy source. (*sips coffee*)
**Globally, everyone's jaws drop and Imu seethes**

Or something like that.

 

[Fox666]

infinite energy to make all islands float!

That's actually a good theory

====================

Could it be that the name of the Great Kingdom is just "Shandora"?

That would mean that the city being blasted into the sky was not an accident, but intentional. And Noland being made into a liar was a bigger conspiracy than it appeared at first.

 

[RaisinRisin]

That's actually a good theory

====================

Could it be that the name of the Great Kingdom is just "Shandora"?

That would mean that the city being blasted into the sky was not an accident, but intentional. And Noland being made into a liar was a bigger conspiracy than it appeared at first.

I was just kidding around there for the most part, but it's possible it could go something like that, except I'd like to think Stella would have the sense not to bring up the Great Kingdom without realizing it.

Shandora didn't have advanced technology. The story with Noland made that clear. But I hope to get more clarification on the history of the sky peoples eventually. I'm sure they worshipped a non-corporeal sun god before they turned to a giant serpent.

It's very possible the impressive "polar shift" theory I just recently heard about is about to be either proven or disproven by Vegapunk's speech.

Spoiler: quick summary

If the people who composed that theory are right, then when the next pole shift occurs (i.e. the blue planet's tilt moves 90 degrees), the Red Line will become the equator, and Calm Belts will go away so there won't be a Grand Line anymore. The distribution of water shifts because it's always deeper around the equator (centrifugal force). By this theory, it's not just that islands we know are sinking-- there are also islands that are sunken right now and they will surface.

By that theory, they believe the Great Kingdom is actually currently underwater at the old north pole (that sunk during the last pole shift). Its location would be a place deep in the sea beneath the Red Line just like Fishman Island, but instead of being under Mary Geoise, it's under

Spoiler: more detailed location info

Reverse Mountain and extends to both sides of it around where both Laboon and Loguetown would be.

There's more in the video, but it's key that "Lodestar Island" at the end of the Grand Line is a reference to a guiding star for the North Pole, but so is "Polestar Island," which is where Loguetown is located. Lodestar is the same as Polestar. Loguetown is also "the town of the beginning and the end."

The only real criticism I can think of after having seen that vid last weekend (other than too much focus on Oda's minor references to Disney) is that it doesn't explain why the weapon Imu used on Lulusia can punch a hole through the ocean that doesn't fill up. That doesn't even come close to disproving their theory though; it just implies there's some other reason for the holes to behave like that.

 

[Fox666]

It's very possible the impressive "polar shift" theory I just recently heard about is about to be either proven or disproven by Vegapunk's speech.

That theory is very wrong in many ways.

It's all based on the idea that the equators is on the Grand Line. But it isn't, it's easy to understand where the equator is, it crosses the East and West Blues, and the North and South blue are on the poles.

 

[RaisinRisin]

That theory is very wrong in many ways.

It's all based on the idea that the equators is on the Grand Line. But it isn't, it's easy to understand where the equator is, it crosses the East and West Blues, and the North and South blue are on the poles.

While we don't have a detailed world map, we do have official maps that show the North Pole (北極) is currently between North and East Blue, and the South Pole (南極) is between South and West Blue.

Here's the official map on the wiki.
Here's Oda's famous concept drawing.

North and South Pole are marked on both. What other ways do you believe this theory is wrong?

 

[Fox666]

While we don't have a detailed world map, we do have official maps that show the North Pole (北極) is currently between North and East Blue, and the South Pole (南極) is between South and West Blue.

Here's the official map on the wiki.
Here's Oda's famous concept drawing.

North and South Pole are marked on both. What other ways do you believe this theory is wrong?

That's just a concept art from Oda

As far as the manga goes, North Blue is in the north, and the Grand Line is not aligned with the equator

 

[RaisinRisin]

That's just a concept art from Oda

As far as the manga goes, North Blue is in the north, and the Grand Line is not aligned with the equator

I'm always open to compelling arguments, but those maps don't contradict anything I've said. Local area maps don't say anything relevant. I'm guessing you included that world map because it has triangles in four places, but cardinal directions aren't marked. You can get away with that if you only have one arrow, but not if you have four. Using names of geographic features to indicate a direction is not valid in cartography, so those arrows are just pointing to the oceans themselves. You could call it a bit of classic misdirection, since Oda no doubt expected people to assume the world map was more straightforward than it actually is.

You can dismiss the one concept sketch if you want, but I only included it because it's consistent with canon content. Having kept things the same since then indicates Oda has most likely had this concept of the world settled for a long time. The other image in my last post is based directly on the world map from One Piece Magazine vol. 9's "Treatise on the Architecture of the World of One Piece," which came out 4 years ago. It would be extremely strange (and cruel to Oda's core fans) if it wasn't canon.

Here's a partial view of the *original* magazine page that has the exact same world map in it on the right side (with the magazine cover from the issue it appeared in on the left):

(source page here)

Again, we have North Pole marked 北極 at the very top, still legible above the ー in ワンピース. (The person in the image is just speculating on the region where Raftel might be found and not necessarily talking about this theory.)

Again, I'm open to some other explanation from Vegapunk, but I can't see it changing the accuracy of the existing map.