Semifinal - Gildarts vs. Suzaku | Page 5 | MangaHelpers



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Semifinal Gildarts vs. Suzaku

Who wins?

  • Gildarts Clive

    Votes: 25 49.0%
  • Suzaku

    Votes: 26 51.0%

  • Total voters
    51
  • Poll closed .
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Jko

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She fully rested after the Ajeel fight as well. But Azuma noted her injuries which means she was still injured. She was then further injured. Nothing says she suddenly became fit to fight because she rested a night when it didn't happen after Ajeel's fight. Before Irene fight, she fought berserkers and then stop Natsu and Gray which damaged her arms, and then fought Irene. She was far from full strength was Irene.
No, she wasn't. They literally said so in the chapters prior to the next day. Azuma noted the injuries a day prior which has no hold by the next day in which she was fighting better than she had the previous two days. The narrative says so lol. She wouldn't be surviving a enraged Natsu punch or PoF buffed Gray punch had she been in the same condition as she was against the Historia. Didn't know Ikagura and Azuma are stronger than X791 Natsu and DeS + PoF buffed Gray 🤦🏾‍♂️.

The berserker taxed zero of her strength lol. The damage taken from Natsu and Gray did not even inflict actual pain to her. She straight up shrugs off both of their punches without even a grunt of pain.


She was actually above it since she was getting buffed by Wendy.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

What before Ignia showing up their DS magic did absolute shit to Mercophobia. Why are you posting something irrelevant? They did nothing in that pic and were helpless. Not even Natsu damaged him. Only after Natsu starts beating Merc with Ignia's power that they were able to damage him. Previous to that they all did nothing to him with DS magic.
Bruh you can simply look at the panel in which her swords are imbued into Merc's body by Blumenblatt. So yes her swords pierced his scales when imbued with DS magic. Suzaku did nothing to Selene either as shown when Selene is absolutely fine after the small cut to her cheek and not even grunt of pain to even acknowledge the cut. Same with Merc tanking Erza's swords that were imbued into his body.
 

Kurumi Tokisaki

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No, she wasn't. They literally said so in the chapters prior to the next day. Azuma noted the injuries a day prior which has no hold by the next day in which she was fighting better than she had the previous two days. The narrative says so lol. She wouldn't be surviving a enraged Natsu punch or PoF buffed Gray punch had she been in the same condition as she was against the Historia. Didn't know Ikagura and Azuma are stronger than X791 Natsu and DeS + PoF buffed Gray 🤦🏾‍♂️.
I never said she was as injured as during her Neinhart. She didn't completely heal. Erza also rested days after the Ajeel fight and yet still wasn't at full power but somehow she became full strength after resting a day against the battle against Neinhart. Erza fought berserkers and even change armors and it tacks her MP yes. Why are you ignoring it? She then got damaged by Natsu and Gray as well. She was clearly not at full strength.

Bruh you cans simply look at the panel in which swords are imbued into Merc's body by Blumenblatt. So yes her swords pierced his scales when imbued with DS magic. Suzaku did nothing to Selene either as shown when Selene is absolutely fine after the small cut to her cheek and not even grunt of pain to even acknowledge the cut. Same with Merc tanking Erza's swords that were imbued into his body.
What are saying? She never injured Merc nor drew even little blood. She couldn't even scratch him. Only after Natsu started beating his ass that she was able to damage him with DS magic. If it pierced him then he would be bleeding.
 

Kenneth Latorre

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Oooh hidden results. Now I like the sound of that.
 

Jko

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I never said she was as injured as during her Neinhart. She didn't completely heal. Erza also rested days after the Ajeel fight and yet still wasn't at full power but somehow she became full strength after resting a day against the battle against Neinhart. Erza fought berserkers and even change armors and it tacks her MP yes. Why are you ignoring it? She then got damaged by Natsu and Gray as well. She was clearly not at full strength.



What are saying? She never injured Merc nor drew even little blood. She couldn't even scratch him. Only after Natsu started beating his ass that she was able to damage him with DS magic. If it pierced him then he would be bleeding.
Then she clearly was fine otherwise it would have been noted so. Wendy legit said Erza needed more time for recovery, but Erza did not listen and went to the south. It was then repeatedly hammered in that Erza was weakened bcs of her previous encounter. By the third day she was fully recovered. It was was even noted that she was being buffed by Wendy which means she was stronger than her standard self lol. It did not tax MP, she literally only used one reequiped against the beserkers and no name moves. She was damage so much that she wasn't even shown to be in actual pain from their attacks lol.

Merc wasn't shown to bleed from any attack. Blood is not a measurement of injury for a dragon who can turn himself into water lol. Secondly you can clearly see that he was pierced as her swords were literally embedded into his skin. So yes, she did in fact pierce his scales as her swords were clearly lodged into Merc's stomach. I do not see how you arguing against something that is visually shown to be a sword lodged into the Dragon's flesh.

Also by that same sentiment, there was no blood shown to be on Selene's actual body, her dragon form either so no actual injury.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

Oooh hidden results. Now I like the sound of that.
Aren't they always hidden?
 

grey matter

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The damage he actually did to Selene was similar to that of Zirconis and Wendy.

:epicfacepalm

Wendy couldn't even scratch Zirconis

Suzaku did this:


Did she take it on purpose? Yeah. Could she have gotten up? Yeah.
So what? You have to be out of your mind to see the damage inflicted here and say it's comparable to what Wendy did to Zirconis. Absolutely ridiculous
 

Kurumi Tokisaki

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Then she clearly was fine otherwise it would have been noted so. Wendy legit said Erza needed more time for recovery, but Erza did not listen and went to the south. It was then repeatedly hammered in that Erza was weakened bcs of her previous encounter. By the third day she was fully recovered.
Where does it say she was fully recovered when she didn't even have time to fully recover from her injuries against Ajeel. She was further injured after the fight against neinhart but suddenly she was at full strength because you say so?

Merc wasn't shown to bleed from any attack. Blood is not a measurement of injury for a dragon who can turn himself into water lol. Secondly you can clearly see that he was pierced as her swords were literally embedded into his skin. So yes, she did in fact pierce his scales as her swords were clearly lodged into Merc's stomach. I do not see how you arguing against something that is visually shown to be a sword lodged into the Dragon's flesh.
Merc can't turn into water. All he can do is coat himself in water. If it pierced through his skin then he would have bled but he didn't. They did no damage to him as well unless you are saying Erza did something Natsu couldn't even do.

Also by that same sentiment, there was no blood shown to be on Selene's actual body, her dragon form either so no actual injury.
Human form injured is not same as injuring dragon form. Merc human form was injured but when he became a dragon there were no injuries. Irene same and the same with Selene. Only acnologia had injury became he suffered damage to dragon form.
 

Jko

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:epicfacepalm

Wendy couldn't even scratch Zirconis

Suzaku did this:


Did she take it on purpose? Yeah. Could she have gotten up? Yeah.
So what? You have to be out of your mind to see the damage inflicted here and say it's comparable to what Wendy did to Zirconis. Absolutely ridiculous
Which turned out to be a straight lie as stated in the chapter. She made it look like she lost when in reality she was unharmed and out Suzaku's entire realm of power. Suzaku can't hurt Selene, which is literally what this entire chapter was about.

The difference between blunt force and a knife. Much easier to make someone bleed with a sword than wind. Erza did the same to Merc once she had a DS weapon.
Where does it say she was fully recovered when she didn't even have time to fully recover from her injuries against Ajeel. She was further injured after the fight against neinhart but suddenly she was at full strength because you say so?



Merc can't turn into water. All he can do is coat himself in water. If it pierced through his skin then he would have bled but he didn't. They did no damage to him as well unless you are saying Erza did something Natsu couldn't even do.



Human form injured is not same as injuring dragon form. Merc human form was injured but when he became a dragon there were no injuries. Irene same and the same with Selene. Only acnologia had injury became he suffered damage to dragon form.
He turned into water against Natsu. It was legit shown as such. Not really as he did not bleed once in that entire fight as a dragon. Not everything will be depicted by blood. You can clear as day see her swords stuck in his flesh. You arguing against what was clearly shown to be her swords piercing him. If it didn't pierce, they would have bounced off his body like they did against Acno and not be lodged into his flesh. Natsu in Base is below Erza so not surprised at all, and secondly there is once again a difference between blunt force and piercing attacks. It is much easier to harm someone with bladed object then with a concussive force. This easily shown in Laxus vs Erza.

It is. When damage in their natural state the damge transfers over, ergo the same would be for the reverse. Merc also got his magic back to half power ergo not fodder endurance and dura anymore so why would he still be injured in the first place? It was not only Acno but Irene as well. The damage transfers over if they took an actual injury.
 

Kurumi Tokisaki

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It is. When damage in their natural state the damge transfers over, ergo the same would be for the reverse. Merc also got his magic back to half power ergo not fodder endurance and dura anymore so why would he still be injured in the first place? It was not only Acno but Irene as well. The damage transfers over if they took an actual injury.
He didn't turn into water. He coated himself in water otherwise Natsu shouldn't be able to stand on top of him unless Natsu can stand water suddenly. Merc's human form was injured before him turning into a dragon but when he turned into a dragon those injuries are gone. Getting magic power doesn't heal someone. Doesn't know where this is coming from. Same with Irene. No injuries when she turned into a dragon. Same with Selene as well. Injuries are only transferred when their dragon form get's damaged not the other way around. Injuring their human form doesn't do any damage to dragon form.
 

Axiomus

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Selene wasn't unharmed by Selene's slash. Damage doesn't carry over when you transform. The wounds on Irene's human form doesn't show up on her dragon form, and the massive cut that Erza made on Irene's neck disappeared when she reverted back to human. The wound Suzaku inflicted on Irene was real. Selene's reaction to it was what was misleading. She pretended that she couldn't keep fighting when she could. It's still leagues better than anything anyone else has ever done to a God Dragon tier, with the exception of Natsu's secret art.

The latest chapter only proves that DF Natsu stands a chance, because Suzaku no longer has the attack power to defeat a God-Dragon tier which makes it debatable if it can overcome Natsu's near-god-dragon level stats. It doesn't really change the outcome of the tournament. DF Natsu and Suzaku are still leagues above anyone else here, and Suzaku can oneshot Natsu before he can enter DF.
 

grey matter

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Which turned out to be a straight lie as stated in the chapter. She made it look like she lost when in reality she was unharmed and out Suzaku's entire realm of power. Suzaku can't hurt Selene, which is literally what this entire chapter was about.

The difference between blunt force and a knife. Much easier to make someone bleed with a sword than wind. Erza did the same to Merc once she had a DS weapon.
Yeah, she pretended to lose in the sense that she could've got back up. Yet all that damage was real.
All this chapter proved was that she could've one shot in dragon form, and that she jobbed against Suzaku

Yeah no, Erza can keep slashing a God tier, and it will be more useless than Kagura's slash on Larcade. The power behind the sword makes all the difference, you can be fodder and try to cut Selene with a sword, but it won't scratch her
Erza did zero damage to Merc, so...

Selene wasn't unharmed by Selene's slash. Damage doesn't carry over when you transform. The wounds on Irene's human form doesn't show up on her dragon form, and the massive cut that Erza made on Irene's neck disappeared when she reverted back to human.
THISS !!
Eileen had many injuries when she transformed, yet her dragon form was clean lol.
Same happened to Merc also, his human form was bloodied and bandaged, yet we saw nothing in his dragon form.

Not sure why people argue against something that has repeatedly happened. Pretty sure it's deliberate to downplay Suzaku lol, kinda obvious

The latest chapter only proves that DF Natsu stands a chance, because Suzaku no longer has the attack power to defeat a God-Dragon tier which makes it debatable if it can overcome Natsu's near-god-dragon level stats. It doesn't really change the outcome of the tournament. DF Natsu and Suzaku are still leagues above anyone else here, and Suzaku can oneshot Natsu before he can enter DF.
Yeah. DF Natsu is same tier as a nerfed DG in human form.

Considering Suzaku countered and tanked attacks from Selene UNTIL she understood George was the real killer, that makes Suzaku comparable as well
 

Nie Li

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There are people defending Suzaku's feats after this chapter?

Poor guy just got pranked into believing he was stronger than he is.
 

grey matter

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There are people defending Suzaku's feats after this chapter?

Poor guy just got pranked into believing he was stronger than he is.
Yeah, because everything he did until Selene knew it was George who killed Kurnugi was legit. She decided the throw the fight only after getting that info

Could she have gotten up from the attack? Yeah. Could she have gone into dragon form and one shot? Yeah.
These factors still don't change the fact the Suzaku's final attack did all the damage it did to human Selene. Which is far better than what everyone else in the series, bar DF Natsu, has done to Acno/DG tiers

Him one shotting Erza and base Natsu is also legit.
x793 Erza is probably as strong as x792 Gildarts. Even if we scale up Gildarts based on portrayal to 1-2 tiers above Erza, it still won't allow him to one shot Erza and Natsu within a span of like 10 secs
 

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Kenneth Latorre

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How long do these type of fights last?
 

Nemispelled

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Yes it does. Gildarts isn't doing that.

Well, first, we don't even know if Gildartz can do it or not. He sure has the speed feats for it and his cubing technique has only been countered through hax before. Not to mention, he has a track record of oneshotting numerous opponents and has never struggled against Natsu when they were sparring.

And again, Hakune oneshotted Natsu. If she lost to Laxus, I don't see how Suzaku's feat of oneshotting Natsu and Erza puts him above Gildartz, who is likely above Laxus by a solid margin.

Cause turns out she did it with hax, which takes time and can be countered. And she's is fodder in stats, which opens up possibility to one shot her before she hax the enemy

Suzaku did it with pure combat stats. No cheat hax, no nothing. He was simply far superior, that's it

In my personal opinion she should've made it past Laxus, but Suzaku was far more convincing.

I don't think hax matters in this tournament. There's no restriction on it.

As long as the character can convincingly win the match with the feats that they have, then they should advance to the next round. Not to mention, Hakune's MP freezing technique can be casted quite instantly.

Also, just because a hax can be countered, it doesn't make it any less of a feat, especially since Natsu could not counter it himself.

Suzaku may have superior combat stats, but this tournament doesn't distinguish between raw stats and hax.

Hax can be just as superior as skill (whether we like it or not) and is a legitimate way of winning in this tournament.

Anyways, I'm not calling anybody out on Hakune vs. Laxus, but clearly, Suzaku's feats, hype, and portrayal have all taken a major hit.

Like I said in the early stages of this tournament, Gildartz and Hakune were the 2 characters who had the potential to challenge Natsu/Suzaku for the title. The latter two were never the automatic winners in my eyes.


So what if it was Geore who defeated Kurnugi? Suaku became powerful after eating, it has nothing to do with current Suzaku who have Kurnugi's powers that he didn't back then

It matters a lot that Georg was the one who defeated Kurnugi, and for 2 reasons:

1) It severely decreases Suzaku's hype/portrayal because it shows that he doesn't have feats of slaying an actual dragon. Even with Kurnugi's power, he has never shown the feat of slaying an actual dragon; therefore, we cannot assume that he ever did.

2) It destroys his credibility as a character because he initially made the claim that he was the one who "slew Kurnugi", but then just a few chapters later, straight up admitted that Georg was the one who killed the dragon while he simply feasted on someone else's effort.


Suzaku has the feats of one shotting Natsu and Erza

He also has the feat of cutting a DG tier on the cheek BEFORE she decided to job.

He also lasted powered up Selene until she knew it was George who defeated Kurnugi, and only at that point she decided to job

He also has the feats of dealing non insignificant damage to Selene. Yes, she decided to take the hit and job. Yet he still managed to cut her.
If he was some fodder, he wouldn't be even able to scratch a DG tier with his attacks, he can just keep attacking until he exhaust himself, and he still wouldn't land a scratch

Again, having feats of oneshotting Natsu/Erza doesn't automatically put him above Gildartz, especially not when Hakune could perform the same feat against Natsu (and ended up losing to Laxus in the previous match).

As for Selene, he may have damaged her, but it was allowed intentionally by Selene herself. It isn't particularly difficult to inflict damage on someone who wants to be injured in order to fool their opponent.
 
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Tirl

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2) It destroys his credibility as a character because he initially made the claim that he was the one who "slew Kurnugi", but then just a few chapters later, straight up admitted that Georg was the one who killed the dragon while he simply feasted on someone else's effort.
If I remember right, Suzaku didn't claim that he slew Kurnugi, He straight up told her that it was George
 

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If I remember right, Suzaku didn't claim that he slew Kurnugi, He straight up told her that it was George

In Chapters 86 & 90, then yes, he ended up admitting that Georg was the killer, but it was only after Selene cornered him about it due to having doubts about his statement and being skeptical herself:



But in Chapter 81, Suzaku made a false claim and led everyone to believe that he was actually in fact the one who slew Kurnugi:

 

Brandish μ

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After reading the scene properly, Suzaku is not just dehyped by the false Selene feats, but also by his guildmates.
  • Kiria lusts for Laxus, a feat (lmao) that Suzaku could maybe now pull off
  • George is on another level, admitted by all, so he was NEVER a top tier
Suzaku has had plot in his favour and I think he's still got some. So I believe he'll be improving, which makes him more of an Erza type than a Gildarts. The plot has skewed Suzaku's feats, the portrayal is more reliable, this was apparent before the recent chapter. Can't see him beating Gildarts atm.
 

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@grey matter


I forgot to mention in my last post, but I do want to point out that Suzaku was only able to "cut Selene's cheek" because he mentioned Kurnugi's name in his sword saint spell.

Selene was shocked by this (and rightfully so), because Kurnugi is her son - therefore, she made no attempt to avoid that slash to her cheek.

This is in addition to the fact that she was in her human form, which means that her skin was normal human flesh and could be easily cut through.

After this happened, Suzaku didn't have any feats of damaging Selene until she questioned his false claim about slaying Kurnugi, to which he admitted that he straight up lied.



And by the way, Suzaku never lasted against a powered up Selene.

If you notice in the chapter, Selene said she would get a little serious. I'm assuming that you are referring to this statement:



Now, why did she say that she'd only get a little more serious?

Because she wanted to test if he really slew Kurnugi or not.


If she went too easy on him, she wouldn't be able to push him to his limits in order to test his strength relative to Kurnugi's.

If she was fully serious from the start, she would kill him instantly before knowing whether Suzaku actually had the potential to kill her son.

So, her solution was to be only slightly serious, which would prevent her from straight up killing Suzaku, but also allow her to assess his abilities before making a final judgment about whether or not he could kill Kurnugi.

As it turns out, she tested him and called him out on his lie, which forced him to shamefully admit the truth.
 
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