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Canon Vergo vs Sanji with Raid Suit

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King Moe

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Law is much stronger than sanji. His haki is better, that is why he can bypass vergo haki.
Meanwhile vergo wasnt even using his full haki against sanji. Sanji broke his legs the first time vergo used haki. Vergo toyed sanji easily. Just telling u facts
True, but Sanji is not fall off to give Law a challenge given he dealt with him solo better compare to him, so he can defeat Vergo in the end, but takes him longer as Vergo still won't last much given his certain weaknesses and still struggle with nerf Sanji. That is canon fact, so Idk where your read as never happen with broken leg as Sanji was fine later when he walk around. Got stop thinking imagination and bring in medical records like 'certain weaponized character' who been medical more than most.
 

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True, but Sanji is not fall off to give Law a challenge given he dealt with him solo better compare to him, so he can defeat Vergo in the end, but takes him longer as Vergo still won't last much given his certain weaknesses and still struggle with nerf Sanji. That is canon fact, so Idk where your read as never happen with broken leg as Sanji was fine later when he walk around. Got stop thinking imagination and bring in medical records like 'certain weaponized character' who been medical more than most.
Sanji could still walk because vergo spared him. If their fight continued, sanji would be disabled for life. Sanji cant survive the bamboo attacks. Vergo CoA is too much for him
 

King Moe

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Sanji could still walk because vergo spared him. If their fight continued, sanji would be disabled for life. Sanji cant survive the bamboo attacks. Vergo CoA is too much for him
Nah, Sanji would beat his ass in the end just like anyone who suffer injuries in battle and still one-up their opponent still. Sanji's durability even now is no joke, so Idk what you mean and Vergo's COA didn't stop Law from beating him, so again, it's how you use Haki is will help decide that and Vergo will eventuality lose in the end.
 

Critical mindset

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Truth is @King Moe that Vergo was trolling Sanji who was healthy. Let me demonstrate

First half of the fight

Vergo gets blindsided by a fully powered up DJ and literally doesn’t give a fuck.

Next thing he gets hit by Sanji but here is where he arguably doesn't give a fuck about him hitting him, as there is no "?!!" or "!" coming from him so he literally gives no fuck. He might've even let him hit him (it's not unthinkable given the evidence I will demonstrate below). The exclamation points are coming from the marine spectators who comments on the fight before and after the second hit connects on the "fake Vergo" and how well Sanji performs against him.

The second half of the fight

Now here is where so many people stop analysing properly and I will clarify what is actually happening here for the spee D. readers out there who gets this wrong, I will explain what Vergo really did here. It's obvious from the stance here that Vergo is preparing for a roundhouse kick with his left leg, yet when their legs clash it's not from a roundhouse kick from his left, but it is actually their right legs that are clashing!


As you can see here, he prepares a roundhouse kick with his left leg as per the raising of the leg and the shifting of his body radially outwards to produce the necessary torque for this attack (as such not a fast-forward charge as the anime has it, they do their own shit with this whole clash). When he says "don't get in my way" he is about to advance, Sanji then answers back to him, and when Vergo has advanced the necessary launching distance he ostensibly goes in for the roundhouse kick (Sanji prepares the block for it) but the very next moment before Sanji can even react to it, he does not follow through with the execution of that kick, but instead shifts his entire center of mass over to the left leg and goes in for the clash with his right leg(!) That's the real kicker here, as it were, where Vergo switches from building up an attack from the left, to then switch gears completely and moves his entire body mass and attack over to the other leg! As per the highlighted red markings around his leg here that indicates this is an action that happens on the spot; this took Sanji by complete surprise as per the three exclamation points (!!!)


It's clear as day that he was prepering for a roundhouse kick, so why does he not recruit this mass and bodily torque to produce a powerful attack from this? By switching to his left leg and blocking ("attacking") with his right leg, he not only loses the momentum and the power he was building up, but the position itself (standing with one of your legs in front of the other perpendicular to it) is a horrible position where he has no stability, the posture is terrible and no base, as such the center of mass is off but with no trade-off as there is no power being gained from this! Why would he do this?


Not only is it a block, but it is a block with no power as he deliberately switches his body over to the other side and as such is losing all power; in theory this move has no real power behind it and Sanji should really be able to push him back from this. Not only does he not achieve this, but his tibia gets almost broken in half from the impact of them clashing their legs like this where Vergo deliberately makes sure not to leverage any physical power wiht his body, instead nerfing himself by just holding up his leg to block from a shitty position! The result was still one where Sanji almost had his tibia broken in half!

The answer to why Vergo would do this becomes quite obvious: he was trolling Sanji! He was demonstrating how he was faster than what Sanji could react to as he was switching position from ostensibly doing a roundhouse kick to a block from a shitty position, just to mess with his head. Not much unlike how he mid-battle uses his bamboo as a blowgun against Smoker (which has Smoker sweating buckets from this) not because it is an effective weapon in and of itself (Smoker being fast enough to dodge the explosion lol) but because it demonstrates his skill with armament haki, ie combining the elasticity with armanment hardening which point to his armament being exceptionally strong, hence why Smoker was worried from this. As such, Vergo is flexing with Sanji here to show who is really the punk in Punk Hazard (sorry for the pun, just know that Zoro would do worse). Vergo is not only faster here, but his leg is so much stronger that he can break his leg by applying no active force himself! It's a demonstration of power simply put. Vergo had the real terminator theme going for him here with Sanji commenting on his iron body (not tekkai by the way, just his constitution) and what follows from there is a continuation of that.

The anime has Sanji straightening out the leg from their clash, but that's not what happens in the manga. Nothing can be gleaned from the manga that supports what the anime did. Sanji's leg is pointing straight up right after he is seen groaning in pain here. The best way to look at this is that Vergo broke up the lock position in this way which left Sanji like this with his leg pointing straight up, while in the meantime Vergo is already swinging his left leg around in a clockwise direction to deliver a reverse roundhouse kick (as opposed to taking advantage of the opportunity to just deliver a front kick) and this goes by so fast that Sanji struggles to dodge it while Vergo looks bored and casual as fuck. Not only this but his kick is so fast that it actually heats up the air which I highlighted there! That's how fast it is, with Vergo doing this casually.




Casual-as-fuck Vergo didn't give a fuck about landing a straightforward kick, but no instead he is so fast that he can deliver a reverse roundhouse kick while Sanji is standing there rather haplezzly like a fool with his leg in the air. Vergo was trolling and playing with Sanji the latter half of the fight, this becomes quite obvious and this is the only sensible conclusion, him shifting his leg like that, playing and trolling with Sanji. Sanji is slowly but surely losing while Vergo is taking his time playing with his victim.

Vergo arguably shat on Sanji here, and mid-battle the announcement went off that had Vergo thinking and monologuing about Trafalgar Law in the middle of fighting Sanji. Vergo put literally no effort into the fight and the announcement is the plot device that saved Sanji's life! See the exclamation point from Vergo as he is seen listening in on what is going on while paying Sanji no mind, and the next moment he starts monologuing about Law. One clash in the background where Sanji's leg is breaking apart from the sfx of their cclash, then the announcement comes in and Vergo starts monologuing about Law

Next thing Vergo goes his seperate way to stop Law while Sanji from a couple of clashes where Vergo was trolling him has Sanji stressing out about his leg, Oda focusing in on Sanji's leg and the marine soldiers being so worried about how his leg was making creacking noises, while all visible injuries from Sanji's attacks are gone from Vergo next time we see him who has all but forgotten about Sanji's existence.



So to summarise, this was a complete stomp! Vergo was faster than Sanji, he was nerfing himself in the clash and still nearly breaking his tibia in half from this; he was faster than Sanji as the trolled him twice like that showing how Vergo has a real sense of humour actually (Oda made him with two funny character quirks and this evil twist of his is one I can get behind!). Vergo didn't use any armament, he didn't use any of his rokushiki techiques, and he never used his bamboo. Again, not only was it a complete wash, but it would be the equivalent of a Kali master going up against a professional Muay Thai fighter and trashing his leg while putting in minimal effort. I think Sanji is stronger than Zoro in PH and Vergo dominated Sanji here, so imagine the result of Vergo going up aganst Zoro who is a swordsman when he is the equivalent of a kali fighter dominating a Muay Thai fighter at his own game. Sorry to break it to you, Terminator wins and Zoro dies horribly!
 

King Moe

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Truth is @King Moe that Vergo was trolling Sanji who was healthy. Let me demonstrate

First half of the fight

Vergo gets blindsided by a fully powered up DJ and literally doesn’t give a fuck.

Next thing he gets hit by Sanji but here is where he arguably doesn't give a fuck about him hitting him, as there is no "?!!" or "!" coming from him so he literally gives no fuck. He might've even let him hit him (it's not unthinkable given the evidence I will demonstrate below). The exclamation points are coming from the marine spectators who comments on the fight before and after the second hit connects on the "fake Vergo" and how well Sanji performs against him.

The second half of the fight

Now here is where so many people stop analysing properly and I will clarify what is actually happening here for the spee D. readers out there who gets this wrong, I will explain what Vergo really did here. It's obvious from the stance here that Vergo is preparing for a roundhouse kick with his left leg, yet when their legs clash it's not from a roundhouse kick from his left, but it is actually their right legs that are clashing!


As you can see here, he prepares a roundhouse kick with his left leg as per the raising of the leg and the shifting of his body radially outwards to produce the necessary torque for this attack (as such not a fast-forward charge as the anime has it, they do their own shit with this whole clash). When he says "don't get in my way" he is about to advance, Sanji then answers back to him, and when Vergo has advanced the necessary launching distance he ostensibly goes in for the roundhouse kick (Sanji prepares the block for it) but the very next moment before Sanji can even react to it, he does not follow through with the execution of that kick, but instead shifts his entire center of mass over to the left leg and goes in for the clash with his right leg(!) That's the real kicker here, as it were, where Vergo switches from building up an attack from the left, to then switch gears completely and moves his entire body mass and attack over to the other leg! As per the highlighted red markings around his leg here that indicates this is an action that happens on the spot; this took Sanji by complete surprise as per the three exclamation points (!!!)


It's clear as day that he was prepering for a roundhouse kick, so why does he not recruit this mass and bodily torque to produce a powerful attack from this? By switching to his left leg and blocking ("attacking") with his right leg, he not only loses the momentum and the power he was building up, but the position itself (standing with one of your legs in front of the other perpendicular to it) is a horrible position where he has no stability, the posture is terrible and no base, as such the center of mass is off but with no trade-off as there is no power being gained from this! Why would he do this?


Not only is it a block, but it is a block with no power as he deliberately switches his body over to the other side and as such is losing all power; in theory this move has no real power behind it and Sanji should really be able to push him back from this. Not only does he not achieve this, but his tibia gets almost broken in half from the impact of them clashing their legs like this where Vergo deliberately makes sure not to leverage any physical power wiht his body, instead nerfing himself by just holding up his leg to block from a shitty position! The result was still one where Sanji almost had his tibia broken in half!

The answer to why Vergo would do this becomes quite obvious: he was trolling Sanji! He was demonstrating how he was faster than what Sanji could react to as he was switching position from ostensibly doing a roundhouse kick to a block from a shitty position, just to mess with his head. Not much unlike how he mid-battle uses his bamboo as a blowgun against Smoker (which has Smoker sweating buckets from this) not because it is an effective weapon in and of itself (Smoker being fast enough to dodge the explosion lol) but because it demonstrates his skill with armament haki, ie combining the elasticity with armanment hardening which point to his armament being exceptionally strong, hence why Smoker was worried from this. As such, Vergo is flexing with Sanji here to show who is really the punk in Punk Hazard (sorry for the pun, just know that Zoro would do worse). Vergo is not only faster here, but his leg is so much stronger that he can break his leg by applying no active force himself! It's a demonstration of power simply put. Vergo had the real terminator theme going for him here with Sanji commenting on his iron body (not tekkai by the way, just his constitution) and what follows from there is a continuation of that.

The anime has Sanji straightening out the leg from their clash, but that's not what happens in the manga. Nothing can be gleaned from the manga that supports what the anime did. Sanji's leg is pointing straight up right after he is seen groaning in pain here. The best way to look at this is that Vergo broke up the lock position in this way which left Sanji like this with his leg pointing straight up, while in the meantime Vergo is already swinging his left leg around in a clockwise direction to deliver a reverse roundhouse kick (as opposed to taking advantage of the opportunity to just deliver a front kick) and this goes by so fast that Sanji struggles to dodge it while Vergo looks bored and casual as fuck. Not only this but his kick is so fast that it actually heats up the air which I highlighted there! That's how fast it is, with Vergo doing this casually.




Casual-as-fuck Vergo didn't give a fuck about landing a straightforward kick, but no instead he is so fast that he can deliver a reverse roundhouse kick while Sanji is standing there rather haplezzly like a fool with his leg in the air. Vergo was trolling and playing with Sanji the latter half of the fight, this becomes quite obvious and this is the only sensible conclusion, him shifting his leg like that, playing and trolling with Sanji. Sanji is slowly but surely losing while Vergo is taking his time playing with his victim.

Vergo arguably shat on Sanji here, and mid-battle the announcement went off that had Vergo thinking and monologuing about Trafalgar Law in the middle of fighting Sanji. Vergo put literally no effort into the fight and the announcement is the plot device that saved Sanji's life! See the exclamation point from Vergo as he is seen listening in on what is going on while paying Sanji no mind, and the next moment he starts monologuing about Law. One clash in the background where Sanji's leg is breaking apart from the sfx of their cclash, then the announcement comes in and Vergo starts monologuing about Law

Next thing Vergo goes his seperate way to stop Law while Sanji from a couple of clashes where Vergo was trolling him has Sanji stressing out about his leg, Oda focusing in on Sanji's leg and the marine soldiers being so worried about how his leg was making creacking noises, while all visible injuries from Sanji's attacks are gone from Vergo next time we see him who has all but forgotten about Sanji's existence.



So to summarise, this was a complete stomp! Vergo was faster than Sanji, he was nerfing himself in the clash and still nearly breaking his tibia in half from this; he was faster than Sanji as the trolled him twice like that showing how Vergo has a real sense of humour actually (Oda made him with two funny character quirks and this evil twist of his is one I can get behind!). Vergo didn't use any armament, he didn't use any of his rokushiki techiques, and he never used his bamboo. Again, not only was it a complete wash, but it would be the equivalent of a Kali master going up against a professional Muay Thai fighter and trashing his leg while putting in minimal effort. I think Sanji is stronger than Zoro in PH and Vergo dominated Sanji here, so imagine the result of Vergo going up aganst Zoro who is a swordsman when he is the equivalent of a kali fighter dominating a Muay Thai fighter at his own game. Sorry to break it to you, Terminator wins and Zoro dies horribly!
Not saying Sanji win the fight easily, but being injured doesn't push you be bested especially if your bones are cracked as last time I check, didn't Usopp and Harjudan won their fights despite getting even worse bone shattering injuries and beating their respective enemies in the end? I am saying as Sanji would have beaten Vergo in the fight while getting back used to his body and defeating him as even nerf, Vergo took damage from him and he felt it with ease even after hurting his leg, that didn't stop the fight nor stop Sanji still to face him. This could gone the way similar to Luffy vs Katakuri where at first we all thought Luffy would lose in the end to him, but can change around and later defeat him in the end. The fight ended inconclusive, but Sanji would defeated him in the end if time went on and he get adjusted as both were holding back overall.
 

Grandmaster Woro

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Truth is @King Moe that Vergo was trolling Sanji who was healthy. Let me demonstrate

First half of the fight

Vergo gets blindsided by a fully powered up DJ and literally doesn’t give a fuck.

Next thing he gets hit by Sanji but here is where he arguably doesn't give a fuck about him hitting him, as there is no "?!!" or "!" coming from him so he literally gives no fuck. He might've even let him hit him (it's not unthinkable given the evidence I will demonstrate below). The exclamation points are coming from the marine spectators who comments on the fight before and after the second hit connects on the "fake Vergo" and how well Sanji performs against him.

The second half of the fight

Now here is where so many people stop analysing properly and I will clarify what is actually happening here for the spee D. readers out there who gets this wrong, I will explain what Vergo really did here. It's obvious from the stance here that Vergo is preparing for a roundhouse kick with his left leg, yet when their legs clash it's not from a roundhouse kick from his left, but it is actually their right legs that are clashing!


As you can see here, he prepares a roundhouse kick with his left leg as per the raising of the leg and the shifting of his body radially outwards to produce the necessary torque for this attack (as such not a fast-forward charge as the anime has it, they do their own shit with this whole clash). When he says "don't get in my way" he is about to advance, Sanji then answers back to him, and when Vergo has advanced the necessary launching distance he ostensibly goes in for the roundhouse kick (Sanji prepares the block for it) but the very next moment before Sanji can even react to it, he does not follow through with the execution of that kick, but instead shifts his entire center of mass over to the left leg and goes in for the clash with his right leg(!) That's the real kicker here, as it were, where Vergo switches from building up an attack from the left, to then switch gears completely and moves his entire body mass and attack over to the other leg! As per the highlighted red markings around his leg here that indicates this is an action that happens on the spot; this took Sanji by complete surprise as per the three exclamation points (!!!)


It's clear as day that he was prepering for a roundhouse kick, so why does he not recruit this mass and bodily torque to produce a powerful attack from this? By switching to his left leg and blocking ("attacking") with his right leg, he not only loses the momentum and the power he was building up, but the position itself (standing with one of your legs in front of the other perpendicular to it) is a horrible position where he has no stability, the posture is terrible and no base, as such the center of mass is off but with no trade-off as there is no power being gained from this! Why would he do this?


Not only is it a block, but it is a block with no power as he deliberately switches his body over to the other side and as such is losing all power; in theory this move has no real power behind it and Sanji should really be able to push him back from this. Not only does he not achieve this, but his tibia gets almost broken in half from the impact of them clashing their legs like this where Vergo deliberately makes sure not to leverage any physical power wiht his body, instead nerfing himself by just holding up his leg to block from a shitty position! The result was still one where Sanji almost had his tibia broken in half!

The answer to why Vergo would do this becomes quite obvious: he was trolling Sanji! He was demonstrating how he was faster than what Sanji could react to as he was switching position from ostensibly doing a roundhouse kick to a block from a shitty position, just to mess with his head. Not much unlike how he mid-battle uses his bamboo as a blowgun against Smoker (which has Smoker sweating buckets from this) not because it is an effective weapon in and of itself (Smoker being fast enough to dodge the explosion lol) but because it demonstrates his skill with armament haki, ie combining the elasticity with armanment hardening which point to his armament being exceptionally strong, hence why Smoker was worried from this. As such, Vergo is flexing with Sanji here to show who is really the punk in Punk Hazard (sorry for the pun, just know that Zoro would do worse). Vergo is not only faster here, but his leg is so much stronger that he can break his leg by applying no active force himself! It's a demonstration of power simply put. Vergo had the real terminator theme going for him here with Sanji commenting on his iron body (not tekkai by the way, just his constitution) and what follows from there is a continuation of that.

The anime has Sanji straightening out the leg from their clash, but that's not what happens in the manga. Nothing can be gleaned from the manga that supports what the anime did. Sanji's leg is pointing straight up right after he is seen groaning in pain here. The best way to look at this is that Vergo broke up the lock position in this way which left Sanji like this with his leg pointing straight up, while in the meantime Vergo is already swinging his left leg around in a clockwise direction to deliver a reverse roundhouse kick (as opposed to taking advantage of the opportunity to just deliver a front kick) and this goes by so fast that Sanji struggles to dodge it while Vergo looks bored and casual as fuck. Not only this but his kick is so fast that it actually heats up the air which I highlighted there! That's how fast it is, with Vergo doing this casually.




Casual-as-fuck Vergo didn't give a fuck about landing a straightforward kick, but no instead he is so fast that he can deliver a reverse roundhouse kick while Sanji is standing there rather haplezzly like a fool with his leg in the air. Vergo was trolling and playing with Sanji the latter half of the fight, this becomes quite obvious and this is the only sensible conclusion, him shifting his leg like that, playing and trolling with Sanji. Sanji is slowly but surely losing while Vergo is taking his time playing with his victim.

Vergo arguably shat on Sanji here, and mid-battle the announcement went off that had Vergo thinking and monologuing about Trafalgar Law in the middle of fighting Sanji. Vergo put literally no effort into the fight and the announcement is the plot device that saved Sanji's life! See the exclamation point from Vergo as he is seen listening in on what is going on while paying Sanji no mind, and the next moment he starts monologuing about Law. One clash in the background where Sanji's leg is breaking apart from the sfx of their cclash, then the announcement comes in and Vergo starts monologuing about Law

Next thing Vergo goes his seperate way to stop Law while Sanji from a couple of clashes where Vergo was trolling him has Sanji stressing out about his leg, Oda focusing in on Sanji's leg and the marine soldiers being so worried about how his leg was making creacking noises, while all visible injuries from Sanji's attacks are gone from Vergo next time we see him who has all but forgotten about Sanji's existence.



So to summarise, this was a complete stomp! Vergo was faster than Sanji, he was nerfing himself in the clash and still nearly breaking his tibia in half from this; he was faster than Sanji as the trolled him twice like that showing how Vergo has a real sense of humour actually (Oda made him with two funny character quirks and this evil twist of his is one I can get behind!). Vergo didn't use any armament, he didn't use any of his rokushiki techiques, and he never used his bamboo. Again, not only was it a complete wash, but it would be the equivalent of a Kali master going up against a professional Muay Thai fighter and trashing his leg while putting in minimal effort.
This. Vergo just toyed sanji easily. This is a win for vergo with low difficulty
 

Critical mindset

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This. Vergo just toyed sanji easily. This is a win for vergo with low difficulty
Vergo has got the terminator theme going for him and as such I think was meant to be indestrucitlbe back then

Vergo is in my opinion based on Yuri Boyka. Compare this scene where he breaks his oppponents leg in an epic clash (Boyka has a broken chin at this point). I think Oda wanted to make Vergo breaking Sanji's tibia like that mirror this iconic scene in Undisputed 3. Yiu can't deny there are some resemblances between Scott Adkins and Vergo
Vergo is also based on the immortal god figure in vietnamese culture Giong
 

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Vergo has got the terminator theme going for him and as such I think was meant to be indestrucitlbe back then

Vergo is in my opinion based on Yuri Boyka. Compare this scene where he breaks his oppponents leg in an epic clash (Boyka has a broken chin at this point). I think Oda wanted to make Vergo breaking Sanji's tibia like that mirror this iconic scene in Undisputed 3. Yiu can't deny there are some resemblances between Scott Adkins and Vergo
Vergo is also based on the immortal god figure in vietnamese culture Giong
Yeah i can see that. Vergo crushing sanji legs is a homage to undisputed 3 scene. Pretty interesting idea
 

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Yeah i can see that. Vergo crushing sanji legs is a homage to undisputed 3 scene. Pretty interesting idea
Not really, but doesn't take away the fact Vergo couldn't beat him and got busted open twice when Sanji kick him again and again. If it continue, the victory be Sanji in the end. He doesn't falter even nerf unlike an 'certain weaponized user' after all.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

This. Vergo just toyed sanji easily. This is a win for vergo with low difficulty
Nah, Sanji easily destroyed Vergo. The man won't handle it in the end and your adding RS to the matter which he has no luck at all to beat. Vergo at his best can be YV, but even then, he isn't stronger from actual ones we seen. Vergo is No-Diff territory at this point.
 
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Critical mindset

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Not really, but doesn't take away the fact Vergo couldn't beat him and got busted open twice when Sanji kick him again and again. If it continue, the victory be Sanji in the end. He doesn't falter even nerf unlike an 'certain weaponized user' after all.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---



Nah, Sanji easily destroyed Vergo. The man won't handle it in the end and your adding RS to the matter which he has no luck at all to beat. Vergo at his best can be YV, but even then, he isn't stronger from actual ones we seen. Vergo is No-Diff territory at this point.
--- Double Post Merged, ---



Nah, don't see it as pretty sure Oda mention who he based Vergo on in interviews and those aren't it at all as well your scratching surface to make that parallel there when difference is Sanji kept fighting and make Vergo run away in the end, the one who you based on didn't and won fighting to the end. Vergo got his ass beat by Sanji and then Law later, so nothing push that especially series go another way than who your trying to compare.
Why would he mention who he based Vergo on in interviews? Has that question ever been posed to him? There are undeniable parrallells between Vergo and the Terminator, that's for sure. I can name you plenty of those if you want. Has Oda said anything about Terminator? No, he hasn't said anything about Vergo bc he is saving him for later. We don't even know Vergo's past even though we know the Germa soldiers are based on his design
 

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Not really, but doesn't take away the fact Vergo couldn't beat him and got busted open twice when Sanji kick him again and again. If it continue, the victory be Sanji in the end. He doesn't falter even nerf unlike an 'certain weaponized user' after all.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---



Nah, Sanji easily destroyed Vergo. The man won't handle it in the end and your adding RS to the matter which he has no luck at all to beat. Vergo at his best can be YV, but even then, he isn't stronger from actual ones we seen. Vergo is No-Diff territory at this point.
vergo actually was nerfed hard initially. He didn't bother to use CoA hardening or bamboo weapon.

sanji could only hit vergo because vergo wasn't taking him seriously.
Vergo wasn't even going all out (no bamboo weapon used) against sanji and he managed to break sanji legs in one hit.
Vergo no-diffed sanji.
 
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King Moe

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sanji could only hit vergo because vergo wasn't taking him seriously.
Vergo wasn't even going all out (no bamboo weapon used) against sanji and he managed to break sanji legs in one hit.
Vergo no-diffed sanji.
No, he hit Vergo cause Vergo lack to keep up with Sanji overall especially he couldn't beat a nerf guy to complete his mission. Just Vergo realize Sanji was much stronger than he looks and in the end Vergo fled from him and knew he would get beaten in the end. Sanji would No-Diff him at this point as he no longer an issue. He is more credible opponent though unlike some slow giant piece of rock you called Pica for 'certain weaponized user' after all.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

Why would he mention who he based Vergo on in interviews? Has that question ever been posed to him? There are undeniable parrallells between Vergo and the Terminator, that's for sure. I can name you plenty of those if you want. Has Oda said anything about Terminator? No, he hasn't said anything about Vergo bc he is saving him for later. We don't even know Vergo's past even though we know the Germa soldiers are based on his design
Cause he said on interviews who he based them on or on SBS about it as you do know Oda take references on real life stuff, so he would have stated about Vergo awhile back who he is based on, but not that guy. Wait are you saying now Vergo could be former Germa Clone?
 

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Truth is @King Moe that Vergo was trolling Sanji who was healthy. Let me demonstrate

First half of the fight

Vergo gets blindsided by a fully powered up DJ and literally doesn’t give a fuck.

Next thing he gets hit by Sanji but here is where he arguably doesn't give a fuck about him hitting him, as there is no "?!!" or "!" coming from him so he literally gives no fuck. He might've even let him hit him (it's not unthinkable given the evidence I will demonstrate below). The exclamation points are coming from the marine spectators who comments on the fight before and after the second hit connects on the "fake Vergo" and how well Sanji performs against him.

The second half of the fight

Now here is where so many people stop analysing properly and I will clarify what is actually happening here for the spee D. readers out there who gets this wrong, I will explain what Vergo really did here. It's obvious from the stance here that Vergo is preparing for a roundhouse kick with his left leg, yet when their legs clash it's not from a roundhouse kick from his left, but it is actually their right legs that are clashing!


As you can see here, he prepares a roundhouse kick with his left leg as per the raising of the leg and the shifting of his body radially outwards to produce the necessary torque for this attack (as such not a fast-forward charge as the anime has it, they do their own shit with this whole clash). When he says "don't get in my way" he is about to advance, Sanji then answers back to him, and when Vergo has advanced the necessary launching distance he ostensibly goes in for the roundhouse kick (Sanji prepares the block for it) but the very next moment before Sanji can even react to it, he does not follow through with the execution of that kick, but instead shifts his entire center of mass over to the left leg and goes in for the clash with his right leg(!) That's the real kicker here, as it were, where Vergo switches from building up an attack from the left, to then switch gears completely and moves his entire body mass and attack over to the other leg! As per the highlighted red markings around his leg here that indicates this is an action that happens on the spot; this took Sanji by complete surprise as per the three exclamation points (!!!)


It's clear as day that he was prepering for a roundhouse kick, so why does he not recruit this mass and bodily torque to produce a powerful attack from this? By switching to his left leg and blocking ("attacking") with his right leg, he not only loses the momentum and the power he was building up, but the position itself (standing with one of your legs in front of the other perpendicular to it) is a horrible position where he has no stability, the posture is terrible and no base, as such the center of mass is off but with no trade-off as there is no power being gained from this! Why would he do this?


Not only is it a block, but it is a block with no power as he deliberately switches his body over to the other side and as such is losing all power; in theory this move has no real power behind it and Sanji should really be able to push him back from this. Not only does he not achieve this, but his tibia gets almost broken in half from the impact of them clashing their legs like this where Vergo deliberately makes sure not to leverage any physical power wiht his body, instead nerfing himself by just holding up his leg to block from a shitty position! The result was still one where Sanji almost had his tibia broken in half!

The answer to why Vergo would do this becomes quite obvious: he was trolling Sanji! He was demonstrating how he was faster than what Sanji could react to as he was switching position from ostensibly doing a roundhouse kick to a block from a shitty position, just to mess with his head. Not much unlike how he mid-battle uses his bamboo as a blowgun against Smoker (which has Smoker sweating buckets from this) not because it is an effective weapon in and of itself (Smoker being fast enough to dodge the explosion lol) but because it demonstrates his skill with armament haki, ie combining the elasticity with armanment hardening which point to his armament being exceptionally strong, hence why Smoker was worried from this. As such, Vergo is flexing with Sanji here to show who is really the punk in Punk Hazard (sorry for the pun, just know that Zoro would do worse). Vergo is not only faster here, but his leg is so much stronger that he can break his leg by applying no active force himself! It's a demonstration of power simply put. Vergo had the real terminator theme going for him here with Sanji commenting on his iron body (not tekkai by the way, just his constitution) and what follows from there is a continuation of that.

The anime has Sanji straightening out the leg from their clash, but that's not what happens in the manga. Nothing can be gleaned from the manga that supports what the anime did. Sanji's leg is pointing straight up right after he is seen groaning in pain here. The best way to look at this is that Vergo broke up the lock position in this way which left Sanji like this with his leg pointing straight up, while in the meantime Vergo is already swinging his left leg around in a clockwise direction to deliver a reverse roundhouse kick (as opposed to taking advantage of the opportunity to just deliver a front kick) and this goes by so fast that Sanji struggles to dodge it while Vergo looks bored and casual as fuck. Not only this but his kick is so fast that it actually heats up the air which I highlighted there! That's how fast it is, with Vergo doing this casually.




Casual-as-fuck Vergo didn't give a fuck about landing a straightforward kick, but no instead he is so fast that he can deliver a reverse roundhouse kick while Sanji is standing there rather haplezzly like a fool with his leg in the air. Vergo was trolling and playing with Sanji the latter half of the fight, this becomes quite obvious and this is the only sensible conclusion, him shifting his leg like that, playing and trolling with Sanji. Sanji is slowly but surely losing while Vergo is taking his time playing with his victim.

Vergo arguably shat on Sanji here, and mid-battle the announcement went off that had Vergo thinking and monologuing about Trafalgar Law in the middle of fighting Sanji. Vergo put literally no effort into the fight and the announcement is the plot device that saved Sanji's life! See the exclamation point from Vergo as he is seen listening in on what is going on while paying Sanji no mind, and the next moment he starts monologuing about Law. One clash in the background where Sanji's leg is breaking apart from the sfx of their cclash, then the announcement comes in and Vergo starts monologuing about Law

Next thing Vergo goes his seperate way to stop Law while Sanji from a couple of clashes where Vergo was trolling him has Sanji stressing out about his leg, Oda focusing in on Sanji's leg and the marine soldiers being so worried about how his leg was making creacking noises, while all visible injuries from Sanji's attacks are gone from Vergo next time we see him who has all but forgotten about Sanji's existence.



So to summarise, this was a complete stomp! Vergo was faster than Sanji, he was nerfing himself in the clash and still nearly breaking his tibia in half from this; he was faster than Sanji as the trolled him twice like that showing how Vergo has a real sense of humour actually (Oda made him with two funny character quirks and this evil twist of his is one I can get behind!). Vergo didn't use any armament, he didn't use any of his rokushiki techiques, and he never used his bamboo. Again, not only was it a complete wash, but it would be the equivalent of a Kali master going up against a professional Muay Thai fighter and trashing his leg while putting in minimal effort. I think Sanji is stronger than Zoro in PH and Vergo dominated Sanji here, so imagine the result of Vergo going up aganst Zoro who is a swordsman when he is the equivalent of a kali fighter dominating a Muay Thai fighter at his own game. Sorry to break it to you, Terminator wins and Zoro dies horribly!
I don't agree with the whole "Vergo switched from the roundhouse kick to a kick with his right and then again with his left". For me it's obvious Vergo clashes with his left leg in the same exact roundhouse pose from the previous panel in which he was lifting his leg. Then they break the clash and he immediately follows up with a falling kick with the same left leg.


However, that being said, the rest is right: Vergo completely ignored diable jambe kicks and didn't feel the need to coat himself in haki nor to use his weapon, and his first kick broke Sanji's leg bone.
That's not just any wound, that would be like one of Zoro's swords cracking after clashing one slash against an opponent. Since Sanji's legs are his weapons, it's exactly the same thing: Sanji would have been done if the fight had gone on and he wouldn't have dealt significant damage either.

His last panel you posted with Sanji himself thinking "This is bad... If the fight had kept going like that..." is a straight admission by Sanji himself that he was going to lose if the fight hadn't been interrupted.
 

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He is more credible opponent though unlike some slow giant piece of rock you called Pica for 'certain weaponized user' after all.
topic is about sanji vs vergo, dont bring ur hatred for zoro here
anyway, the fight ended with sanji having broken legs. Vergo gained the upper hand against sanji. Just telling u facts
 

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I don't agree with the whole "Vergo switched from the roundhouse kick to a kick with his right and then again with his left". For me it's obvious Vergo clashes with his left leg in the same exact roundhouse pose from the previous panel in which he was lifting his leg. Then they break the clash and he immediately follows up with a falling kick with the same left leg.


However, that being said, the rest is right: Vergo completely ignored diable jambe kicks and didn't feel the need to coat himself in haki nor to use his weapon, and his first kick broke Sanji's leg bone.
That's not just any wound, that would be like one of Zoro's swords cracking after clashing one slash against an opponent. Since Sanji's legs are his weapons, it's exactly the same thing: Sanji would have been done if the fight had gone on and he wouldn't have dealt significant damage either.

His last panel you posted with Sanji himself thinking "This is bad... If the fight had kept going like that..." is a straight admission by Sanji himself that he was going to lose if the fight hadn't been interrupted.
Does Vergo has a pelvis or not? See how his supposed right foot stationed on the ground is tilting to the left. How is that possible? And where is his right thigh in all of this? and on top of that, why is there a gaping hole on the right side of his lab coat when in reality there should be a elg there ? Can you explain all of that?


If it is his left leg or right leg, then we should be able to tell just by wathcing the contour of the foot. See how the inside of the foot is more pronounced with a dimple and the outside being longer? :) We can tell it is his right leg just by seeing how the inside of the foot is on top, not the left leg.

Even if by some miracle Vergo actually can achieve that bodily configuration anatomically, you do realise it doesn't help your case? That position has no stability, so the mere fact that Vergo can leverage any power, in fact so much power that he actually breaks Sanji's fibula almost in half, that msut be the greatest troll move I have ever seen in my life and an amazing tribute to Vergo. Either way you sliced it Vergo trolled Sanji.

Vergo beating Sanji would be the equivalent of this guy breaking Samkor in a kicking match ;)
Cause he said on interviews who he based them on or on SBS about it as you do know Oda take references on real life stuff, so he would have stated about Vergo awhile back who he is based on, but not that guy. Wait are you saying now Vergo could be former Germa Clone?
Are you sure? Can you show me the intervirew where Vergo is mentioned then? The germa clones are based on the blueprints made for Vergo. The clones are of course pale shadows to the man himself, but Vergo was the genesis for Germa.
 

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Does Vergo has a pelvis or not? See how his supposed right foot stationed on the ground is tilting to the left. How is that possible? And where is his right thigh in all of this? and on top of that, why is there a gaping hole on the right side of his lab coat when in reality there should be a elg there ? Can you explain all of that?
Yes, I can.
I'm sorry but no matter how I look at the picture, he's kicking with his left leg and the posture makes much more sense than that being his right leg (also makes more sense going by the context of the previous and the next panels showing him moving only the left leg).
We don't wee where his right foot stationed on the ground is tilting to. His right thig is covered by the coat. You can see where his hip starts. Follow it down and there it is.
There should be no leg in the "gaping hole of his lab coat". His lab coat is moving around because of inertia and you can see how the left side of his lab coat is lifted because it lifts with his left, while the right side of his lab coat just falls down and goes to the front (due to inertia) because his right left is the one grounded. If he had lifted his right leg, the way his lab coat falls around it would make no sense.

Honest to God, I don't know how you can interpret that as it being his right leg. Not trying to sound rude.

If it is his left leg or right leg, then we should be able to tell just by wathcing the contour of the foot. See how the inside of the foot is more pronounced with a dimple and the outside being longer? :) We can tell it is his right leg just by seeing how the inside of the foot is on top, not the left leg.
The foot does look weird, I'll give you that, but the rest of Vergo's figure and context just scream "left leg" so much to me that I can't picture that foot as anything other than Oda not doing a great job drawing it.

Even if by some miracle Vergo actually can achieve that bodily configuration anatomically, you do realise it doesn't help your case? That position has no stability, so the mere fact that Vergo can leverage any power, in fact so much power that he actually breaks Sanji's fibula almost in half, that msut be the greatest troll move I have ever seen in my life and an amazing tribute to Vergo. Either way you sliced it Vergo trolled Sanji.

Vergo beating Sanji would be the equivalent of this guy breaking Samkor in a kicking match ;)
How does a normal roundhouse kick look anatomically weirder to you than a pose that would damage his knee if it was a block with the right leg?
I mean, the pose you suggest is the anatomically weird one, much more in a fight. That's the position that would lack stability and "any power", while a roundhouse kick IS filled with power.

However, was that bit really directed ot me? Reread my previous post. The only thing I disagree on is on the weird way you picture Vergo's positioning, I openly supported that Sanji would have lost.


Are you sure? Can you show me the intervirew where Vergo is mentioned then? The germa clones are based on the blueprints made for Vergo. The clones are of course pale shadows to the man himself, but Vergo was the genesis for Germa.
Their hairline is different from Vergo's. Their only similarities is the square face and the glasses.
 

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Yes, I can.
I'm sorry but no matter how I look at the picture, he's kicking with his left leg and the posture makes much more sense than that being his right leg (also makes more sense going by the context of the previous and the next panels showing him moving only the left leg).
We don't wee where his right foot stationed on the ground is tilting to. His right thig is covered by the coat. You can see where his hip starts. Follow it down and there it is.
There should be no leg in the "gaping hole of his lab coat". His lab coat is moving around because of inertia and you can see how the left side of his lab coat is lifted because it lifts with his left, while the right side of his lab coat just falls down and goes to the front (due to inertia) because his right left is the one grounded. If he had lifted his right leg, the way his lab coat falls around it would make no sense.

Honest to God, I don't know how you can interpret that as it being his right leg. Not trying to sound rude.


The foot does look weird, I'll give you that, but the rest of Vergo's figure and context just scream "left leg" so much to me that I can't picture that foot as anything other than Oda not doing a great job drawing it.


How does a normal roundhouse kick look anatomically weirder to you than a pose that would damage his knee if it was a block with the right leg?
I mean, the pose you suggest is the anatomically weird one, much more in a fight. That's the position that would lack stability and "any power", while a roundhouse kick IS filled with power.

However, was that bit really directed ot me? Reread my previous post. The only thing I disagree on is on the weird way you picture Vergo's positioning, I openly supported that Sanji would have lost.



Their hairline is different from Vergo's. Their only similarities is the square face and the glasses.
Yeah I don’t know what to tell you man. The supposed right leg is tilting to his left side while simultaneously doing that pose. Why don’t you try to emulate the pose with the left yourself? What is stopping you from doing it? Go and stand in front of a mirror and try stand like he does.

i never claimed the right leg position was a good one (hence why I called him trolling Sanji) but it is at any rate a better one than the anatomically impossible stance you think he does.
 

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Yeah I don’t know what to tell you man. The supposed right leg is tilting to his left side while simultaneously doing that pose. Why don’t you try to emulate the pose with the left yourself? What is stopping you from doing it? Go and stand in front of a mirror and try stand like he does.

i never claimed the right leg position was a good one (hence why I called him trolling Sanji) but it is at any rate a better one than the anatomically impossible stance you think he does.
The right leg tilting is just an impression you're getting. Nothing else. There's nothing weird with the pose of that roundhouse kick other than Oda's usual weird scalling.
 

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topic is about sanji vs vergo, dont bring ur hatred for zoro here
anyway, the fight ended with sanji having broken legs. Vergo gained the upper hand against sanji. Just telling u facts
Who mention Zoro? Just pointing out the facts Vergo is stronger threat than Pica who you brought up was stronger foe when he wasn't. Sanji beat Vergo in the end and leave him defeated with cracked skull afterwards. Just telling you how it goes unlike 'certain character'.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

I don't agree with the whole "Vergo switched from the roundhouse kick to a kick with his right and then again with his left". For me it's obvious Vergo clashes with his left leg in the same exact roundhouse pose from the previous panel in which he was lifting his leg. Then they break the clash and he immediately follows up with a falling kick with the same left leg.


However, that being said, the rest is right: Vergo completely ignored diable jambe kicks and didn't feel the need to coat himself in haki nor to use his weapon, and his first kick broke Sanji's leg bone.
That's not just any wound, that would be like one of Zoro's swords cracking after clashing one slash against an opponent. Since Sanji's legs are his weapons, it's exactly the same thing: Sanji would have been done if the fight had gone on and he wouldn't have dealt significant damage either.

His last panel you posted with Sanji himself thinking "This is bad... If the fight had kept going like that..." is a straight admission by Sanji himself that he was going to lose if the fight hadn't been interrupted.
Nah he didn't ignored them as you wouldn't bleed from attacks from someone and be pushed back if you weren't taking damage. Also no proof he didn't use Haki as invisible Haki exist and Sanji did all that to him easily while nerf and wasn't even 100% in this. He forced Vergo to leave when he couldn't do his mission in the end and realize Sanji was stronger than he looks for him.

As for phrase, it's not like characters said the worse about their enemies before, but doesn't mean they won't win as look at Luffy vs Katakuri as Luffy felt the same with his opponent, but best him in the end. Sanji was shown fine later in the arc with no pain to his legs at all and even kept moving to help others. So nothing to truly say about how fight will go as leg thing been debunked for many ages and old now. Sanji would defeat him eventuality into the fight and Sanji in his current state now would easily beat him at this point.
--- Double Post Merged, ---

Does Vergo has a pelvis or not? See how his supposed right foot stationed on the ground is tilting to the left. How is that possible? And where is his right thigh in all of this? and on top of that, why is there a gaping hole on the right side of his lab coat when in reality there should be a elg there ? Can you explain all of that?


If it is his left leg or right leg, then we should be able to tell just by wathcing the contour of the foot. See how the inside of the foot is more pronounced with a dimple and the outside being longer? :) We can tell it is his right leg just by seeing how the inside of the foot is on top, not the left leg.

Even if by some miracle Vergo actually can achieve that bodily configuration anatomically, you do realise it doesn't help your case? That position has no stability, so the mere fact that Vergo can leverage any power, in fact so much power that he actually breaks Sanji's fibula almost in half, that msut be the greatest troll move I have ever seen in my life and an amazing tribute to Vergo. Either way you sliced it Vergo trolled Sanji.

Vergo beating Sanji would be the equivalent of this guy breaking Samkor in a kicking match ;)


Are you sure? Can you show me the intervirew where Vergo is mentioned then? The germa clones are based on the blueprints made for Vergo. The clones are of course pale shadows to the man himself, but Vergo was the genesis for Germa.
I can go find it, but he stated in about who he based him on, but doubt it who you think. Also if that is true, then Sanji beat his ass even more as he know how clones are and he is clearly no longer a threat to him at this point as Wano shows. Vergo get his ass beat as isn't threat about him facing him how he is now about in PH? Sanji would have take longer to beat him then, yes, but not at this point anymore as Vergo is not above any YCs and hardly YVs at best.
 

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Nah he didn't ignored them as you wouldn't bleed from attacks from someone and be pushed back if you weren't taking damage. Also no proof he didn't use Haki as invisible Haki exist and Sanji did all that to him easily while nerf and wasn't even 100% in this. He forced Vergo to leave when he couldn't do his mission in the end and realize Sanji was stronger than he looks for him.

As for phrase, it's not like characters said the worse about their enemies before, but doesn't mean they won't win as look at Luffy vs Katakuri as Luffy felt the same with his opponent, but best him in the end. Sanji was shown fine later in the arc with no pain to his legs at all and even kept moving to help others. So nothing to truly say about how fight will go as leg thing been debunked for many ages and old now. Sanji would defeat him eventuality into the fight and Sanji in his current state now would easily beat him at this point.
Luffy's arms didn't break after exchanging one hit with Katakuri, so Luffy finally winning against Katakuri wasn't as impossible as Sanji breaking his leg after just one hit.

Thinking Vergo ran away "because he realized Sanji was too strong" is straight up fanfiction.
 
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