Info Shin Prince of Tennis Tournament II - Information & Discussion

[Kaoz]

I see. I'll talk with our tech support about it, although I'm not sure how much can be done.

 

[-Ken-]

Even if Lethal hit the vote wrong or something, the max score would have been 4-6, so it wouldn't make a different in this case.

 

[LetalHawk]

Kai would still won so it doesn't make a difference.

 

[Hardy]

It does matter, maybe the system doesn't work properly, and it might screw some close matchs.

Also... honor

 

[Kaoz]

Alright, I talked to our tech and there is no record of you voting, Letal. It's also unlikely that the system is broken as there were no other reported cases, so I fear your memory might be mistaken.

---

Also here's some stuff about Akaya:

Spoiler

Note that the majority of what I am about to write was taken from Pair Puri 6 (unfortunately the respective pages have never been fully translated).

Alright then, for starters, Kirihara can enter a total of five different modes (although only three of them have official names):
-Red Eyes Mode
-Muga no Kyouchi
-Devil Mode
-Angel Mode
-Sane Devil Mode

1. Red Eyes Mode
This mode is a result of Kirihara’s weak mental abilities, he enters it when he gets angry or excited. As a result, his power and speed are starting to increase.

2. Muga no Kyouchi
There is not much to say about Muga. It has the same requirements as for everyone else, in other words it only activates when Kirihara is completely driven into a corner. Unlike the other known Muga users, Kirihara has never learned how to control it though, so he cannot use Muga to its fullest potential.

3. Devil Mode
Basically an extreme version of Red Eyes Mode. It activates when he is provoked even further and drastically increases his power and speed. On the downside, it negatively affects Kirihara’s health.

4. Angel Mode
Angel Mode can only be used when Kirihara is controlled by Shiraishi. There do not seem to be any boosts to his physical abilities, but his mental will not drop.

5. Sane Devil Mode
This last mode is described as the “ultimate evolution” of Kirihara’s mental abilities. It seems to activate when he is already using Angel Mode and is provoked. Again, this mode can only be used in combination with Shiraishi.


That is about all the information I have from the Pair Puri, thanks to Sai for the relevant translations. Below is a short summary with activation paths.

No mode — [Angry/Excited] -> Red Eyes Mode — [Drive into a corner] -> Muga no Kyouchi
No mode — [Angry/Excited] -> Red Eyes Mode — [Further provoked] -> Devil Mode
No mode — [Controlled by Shiraishi] -> Angel Mode — [Provoked] -> Sane Devil Mode


I am not completely sure if Muga actually requires Red Eyes Mode to be activated first, but it looked like that to me from the Pair Puri RAWs. In a situation in which either Devil Mode or Muga could be activated, Devil Mode seems to take precedence though.

 

[Pat]

If you have doubts, even though you can't see the poll results, you can check the number of voters which must increase after you voted. (by 1 or 2 depending on whether you have a post in the thread or not)

 

[Kaoz]

Block B's matches are over, which concludes the first round of the tournament. Yamato beat Inui with 8 votes to 6, Hyoutei's future captain Hyoshi defeated Higa's Hirakoba 8 - 4 and the doubles pair of Marui Bunta and Kaidou Kaoru narrowly won over Chitose Senri and Inui Sadaaharu (6 - 4).

The first half of the semifinal matches have started:
Singles - High Tier: Tachibana Kippei vs Momoshiro Takeshi
Singles - Low Tier: Kai Yuujirou vs Amane Hikaru
Doubles: Shiraishi Kuranosuke / Matsudaira Chikahiko vs Oshitari Kenya / Oshitari Yuushi

 

[-Ken-]

It was a data tennis match, Yanagi had 0 % chance of winning there, as # 17 knew everything about him, but he didn't know anything at all about Inui...

Now, this is simply not true. He and Inui and childhood friend. He's the one who teach Inui data tennis. They were former partner in doubles, actually. How close are they? They are simply call undefeated. That's impressive in PoT world.

Since they are that close, how can you say he doesn't know anything about Inui? He really have to know a few things.

In fact, this isn't even a debate. Look here.

http://www.mangahere.com/manga/prince_of_tennis/c209/5.html

It's simply indisputable fact.

If anything, Inui's the one to not know sufficient data on Renji. This is even shown in the National final, where Renji ask Inui "Do you really think you have collect all of my data?". Despite that, Inui manage to win.

And let's not get start about #17. He's in Inui spot in that match. Exact same spot. He teach Inui data tennis. #17 teach him data tennis. As I stated before, he even should really have more data collect about #17 due to #17 being part of the oversea team and he's just being a nobody.

 

[Hardy]

Now, this is simply not true. He and Inui and childhood friend. He's the one who teach Inui data tennis. They were former partner in doubles, actually. How close are they? They are simply call undefeated. That's impressive in PoT world.

Since they are that close, how can you say he doesn't know anything about Inui? He really have to know a few things.

In fact, this isn't even a debate. Look here.

http://www.mangahere.com/manga/prince_of_tennis/c209/5.html

It's simply indisputable fact.

If anything, Inui's the one to not know sufficient data on Renji. This is even shown in the National final, where Renji ask Inui "Do you really think you have collect all of my data?". Despite that, Inui manage to win.

And let's not get start about #17. He's in Inui spot in that match. Exact same spot. He teach Inui data tennis. #17 teach him data tennis. As I stated before, he even should really have more data collect about #17 due to #17 being part of the oversea team and he's just being a nobody.

I wasn't talking about how much Yanagi knew Inui, I was talking about no 17 not knowing Inui at all but perfectly knowing Yanagi. So... yeah, you kinda wasted time with that long reply.

 

[-Ken-]

If Yanagi is confirm to be a collect data mid match type and Inui been shown to collect data mid match, it would be hilariously disappointing if #17 can't do the same but better than Renji and Inui. Laughably so.

 

[Hardy]

He could, that's why he had almost 67 % chance of winning...

 

[-Ken-]

A lot worst than 100% chance of winning, wouldn't you say?

We're talking about someone who is better than a person who fight evenly with National! Tezuka here. He really should be able to shut down Inui completely if Inui is as weak as you suggest. Inui is minimum as strong as Renji now, really.

 

[Kaoz]

Guys, while I normally don't mind discussion, we've gone over this topic who knows how many times before. If you haven't changed the other side's opinion by now, chances are it's not gonna happen.

 

[Ninomiya]

Nobody wants to explain a response to my original post on freaking Shishido?

 

[Kaoz]

I expected Hirakoba to advance and didn't want to take away from the discussion. Long story short though, Shishido's Rising Counter takes care of Habu's spin and if it comes to a pure rally battle, I think Shishido has the upper hand with his Dash and Rising Counter against Hirakoba's nothing. If you want to have an argument for why Shishido beat Kikumaru, I would like to direct you to the arguments I made in the match thread.

---

Also, since all characters are now revealed, you guys can start criticizing my choices if you want.

 

[Hardy]

Nobody wants to explain a response to my original post on freaking Shishido?

I agree, and even presented my arguments in the thread... is that enough?

---------- Post added at 04:39 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:33 PM ----------

Also, since all characters are now revealed, you guys can start criticizing my choices if you want.

YOU SUCK.

Nah, they are fine I guess... but imo there are some clear favourites in every tier. Kite, Tachibana and Shiraishi are in another lvl compared to the other top tiers. In the low tier, I still believe that Kikumaru would crush anyone there.

Doubles are cool though, as there's a lot more to discuss and it's more interesting...

Overall, even if I wanted it to have more characters, the choices were fine imo.

 

[Ninomiya]

I expected Hirakoba to advance and didn't want to take away from the discussion. Long story short though, Shishido's Rising Counter takes care of Habu's spin and if it comes to a pure rally battle, I think Shishido has the upper hand with his Dash and Rising Counter against Hirakoba's nothing. If you want to have an argument for why Shishido beat Kikumaru, I would like to direct you to the arguments I made in the match thread.

I made various arguments to those made, as you should know you weren't the only person in that thread Kaoz.

Rising Counter doesn't even aim for a particular place, it just clears it out of the court, Hirakoba was hitting smashes that was getting past Regionals!Fuji, he was rallying excellently with Regionals!Fuji almost single-handedly so the evidence on the person with better rallying skills is in Hirakoba's favour.
Shishido hasn't been shown to rally individually against anybody higher than Regionals!Fuji.

His rallying skills must be lower than Ootori's too, if he couldn't return Neo Scud Serve and then Ootori beat Shishido on Shishido's serve to take the win.
Ootori is stronger than Shishido.

You mention Dash and Rising Counter.
Shishido's Dash catching the Moon Volley not only failed, but was met by Kikumaru fully prepared at the net had the shot been successful. Its not fair ignore that.

Kikumaru has One Man Doubles so the effects of Rising Counter have to be nullified, Since Kikumaru has someone behind him ready for the shot.
Something he showed against Kai's VH countless times where a shot that goes past him he manages to return.
Kikumaru has proven he has the tools to handle Dash + Rising Counter.

If Ootori and Mizuki are the only ones to lose to 6thCourt opposition while Kikumaru was shown to have no problem against his 6thCourt opponent, and Ootori is better than Shishido, then the evidence really is all against Shishido.

Kai would beat Shishido also.

 

[Kaoz]

Rising Counter doesn't even aim for a particular place, it just clears it out of the court

That's not true. In the first Hyoutei match, outside of Scud Serves, Shishido and Ootori mainly scored with Rising Counters.

Hirakoba was hitting smashes that was getting past Regionals!Fuji, he was rallying excellently with Regionals!Fuji almost single-handedly so the evidence on the person with better rallying skills is in Hirakoba's favour.

Where are you getting this from? Higa took an early 3-0 lead, but Seigaku brought it back to 4-5, and one of the two games Higa won during that time was Hirakoba's service game (i.e. Kawamura not being able to hit Habu). In terms of pure rallying, Seigaku seemed far superior.

His rallying skills must be lower than Ootori's too, if he couldn't return Neo Scud Serve and then Ootori beat Shishido on Shishido's serve to take the win.
Ootori is stronger than Shishido.

Incorrect. The tiebreak ended 9-7 in Ootori's favour and we know Shishido didn't return Neo Scud at all, meaning 8/9 of Ootori's points were from serves. In other words, Shishido won 87.5% of actual rallies.

Kikumaru has One Man Doubles so the effects of Rising Counter have to be nullified, Since Kikumaru has someone behind him ready for the shot.

I addressed this in my posts. The one man doubles seemed to consume a considerable amount of stamina, furthermore Kikumaru also lost two games and multiple points in the tiebreak after he started using it. It's by no means invincible.

Something he showed against Kai's VH countless times where a shot that goes past him he manages to return.

"Countless times?" I believe you meant to say twice.

Kai would beat Shishido also.

There are no arguments supporting this. Dash is a better counter to VH than the sealed step is, because while Kikumaru can move from side to side faster than Shishido, he still has to decide at some point. From a standstill position, Shishido's Dash is probably faster, so if he waits longer than Kikumaru did, he won't be wrongfooted (compare it to Sengoku vs Kamio).

 

[Ninomiya]

"Countless times?" I believe you meant to say twice.

Twice however is more than enough to show that it would be enough to handle Rising Counter.
VH > Rising Counter in terms of difficulty.

That's not true. In the first Hyoutei match, outside of Scud Serves, Shishido and Ootori mainly scored with Rising Counters.r he started using it. It's by no means invincible.

Shishido won rallies on his own serve. In PoT, everybody is stronger on their own service game, or usually stronger.
Ootori broke Shishido's service game.
Shishido may have good rallying on his serve but he couldn't even prevail against the skills of Ootori. That shows there isn't much to him.

On this matter, I'd like to ask who you think would win out of Sengoku VS Shishido?
We had Kai bt Sengoku on here which I agreed with so I was wondering.

I addressed this in my posts. The one man doubles seemed to consume a considerable amount of stamina, furthermore Kikumaru also lost two games and multiple points in the tiebreak after he started using it. It's by no means invincible.

Its not invincible but its a great move.
At the same time its not as if Rising Counter and Dash is an invincible combo either.
It couldn't overcome Ootori.

Its not as if Shishido is a tank or anything. Its not like Shishido has a notable attacking move that Atobe thought was worth using. (Viking Horn).
Shishido's notable feats all involve Ootori having his back.
He is able to run freely around with support in Doubles. In Singles he is likely to not be able to compensate which would explain why even Ootori can beat him.

From a standstill position, Shishido's Dash is probably faster, so if he waits longer than Kikumaru did, he won't be wrongfooted (compare it to Sengoku vs Kamio).

This I can agree with I guess, considering Atobe did the same thing and Atobe isn't notably fast.
Although I must counter it with the fact that Shishido is probably 2 years away from Atobe in Singles.

 

[Kaoz]

I'll throw the response from the other thread at the bottom of this post.

Twice however is more than enough to show that it would be enough to handle Rising Counter.
VH > Rising Counter in terms of difficulty.

I have to disagree. Not necessarily with VH being the better offensive move, but Kai won at least 13 points after Kikumaru started using the one man doubles. Returning a move twice over that time is far from what I'd call consistent.

Shishido won rallies on his own serve. In PoT, everybody is stronger on their own service game, or usually stronger.

You mean like in real life? You should know yourself that even when you're serving, winning almost 90% of the points is a very good quota, especially when you're not a big server.

On this matter, I'd like to ask who you think would win out of Sengoku VS Shishido?
We had Kai bt Sengoku on here which I agreed with so I was wondering.

From what I remember, most people found Kai vs Sengoku to be incredibly even and just had to decide for one in the end. Sengoku vs Shishido? I don't know, but since Sengoku seems to be pretty good against speed players, I guess I'd give it to him?

If you want to use this to argue that Kai > Sengoku and Sengoku > Shishido, thus Kai > Shishido, match-ups are a thing.

Its not as if Shishido is a tank or anything. Its not like Shishido has a notable attacking move that Atobe thought was worth using. (Viking Horn).

Viking Horn isn't a move Atobe thinks is worth using, if anything he was mocking it as a low level move, given that he called it "child's play".

Shishido's notable feats all involve Ootori having his back.
He is able to run freely around with support in Doubles. In Singles he is likely to not be able to compensate which would explain why even Ootori can beat him.

I have to disagree again. Of course they're trying to maximize their strengths, it's doubles after all, but if one of them is the backbone of the pair in normal rallies, it's most certainly Shishido (we usually see him rather than Ootori when it isn't time for Scud and Neo Scud).

Although I must counter it with the fact that Shishido is probably 2 years away from Atobe in Singles.

As an overall player, yeah, in terms of speed? Doubtful.

---

Anyway, here's the other response:

Sanada says at the Kantou draw, "The ones to look out for... Are Hyoutei!!".
That's a big statement to make.

That's not exactly what he said. All he said was that overall, Hyoutei was a stronger team than Seigaku, and if he'd be concerned about anyone, it'd be them. But he also says that nothing will stop Rikkai.
So it's more like "Hyoutei are the second strongest, but they're still no match for us."

Except a team consisting of those guys doesn't exist and you're now taking things out of proportion.
A dream team and an actual school team are different.

The difference is smaller than you claim. All of Rikkai's players are supposed to be Tezuka level, even if we're talking about the guy with an injured arm and his best move sealed, that's still pretty damn strong.

Losing to someone on that level doesn't mean you suck.

I should have been more specific and said a joke in comparison to Rikkai.
As I said "their challenge becomes a joke", the context should have implied challenge to Rikkai but whatever.

You originally said that Hyoutei turned into a joke because Akutgawa lost to Marui. You added the challenger part in your second post, and if that was your intention from the beginning, then I apologize.

I don't really disagree that Hyoutei has no business challenging Rikkai, but the same can really be said for almost everyone, so I don't see it as a big deal.

I never even said Shitenhouji or Seigaku either so you've more or less just compiled your own things in something you'd like to argue about.

I named them because they're are the only teams that can somewhat deal with Rikkai to underline that not standing a chance against Rikkai doesn't make you into a terrible team.