Round of 16 Zeref vs Invel

Invel > Zeref · May 21, 2017

Zeref's black magic was burned away/combatted by Natsu's flames, the same flames that got easily frozen by Invel. It still took some time for Natsu to unfreeze himself and Invel could have killed him during that time. Ice Lock worked on Mavis who although not strong factually has among the highest amounts of magic power contained in her body. Hence,I don't see why it wouldn't work on Zeref or even Natsu without friendship bs. Plus he doesn't even need to move to freeze things so I doubt that Zeref's black flame death magic would be much a problem

Raven · May 21, 2017

The Zeref down play here is ridiculous, All this because Natsu defeated him that's clearly this shows how pathetic this fandom is hope Natsu defeat Acnologia at this point to see how ppl will down play him

The winner is obviously Zeref.

~Charging Lightning~ · May 21, 2017

1. The mere fact that Zeref didn't get burned or even affected at all by FDK Natsu using Igneel's flames should be enough proof to say Zeref won't be affected by elemental magic (Ice, fire, lightning, etc) like others are.
2. Natsu with PoF is a million times stronger than Gray with PoF. The two aren't even comparable
3. Before Natsu got his PoF boost Zeref revealed that he was only playing with him, so you can't use any of those feats to downplay him.

I'm done with this debate. There's no point in it because Zeref will still get more votes than Invel assuming the last chapter hasn't made everyone in the fanbase hate Zeref to the extent I'm seeing in this thread.

Jean Grey · May 21, 2017

@~Charging Lightning~ my boy, I completely agree with you and with the fanbase :super

people are just broken from this shitfest we get in the latest chapter's.

Zeref by hype is the second most powerful being in the series.

BUT we should also include feats in which it doesn't bode well for Zeref.

we can stand here all day and repeat he was toying around and he didn't use his most powerful spell called Law but alas, he doesn't have any amazing feats except his immortality which is restricted here.

so I'm giving my vote to Invel.

Gryffindor · May 21, 2017

Gotta agree with @~Charging Lightning~
Too many people here overreacting. I get that the fight was an absolute travesty and Hiro trashed Zeref to the point of no return, but replace Zeref with anyone else, be it Acnologia, August, Irene, in that situation and they end up the same way he did regardless of hax or pure strength.

I mean what do you think is happening to Acno, if/when he comes back.

Guild power too stronk. It sucks, but it is what it is.

Zeref wins.

He does it sitting down...maybe

LaGOAT · May 21, 2017

~Charging Lightning~ said:
1. The mere fact that Zeref didn't get burned or even affected at all by FDK Natsu using Igneel's flames should be enough proof to say Zeref won't be affected by elemental magic (Ice, fire, lightning, etc) like others are.
2. Natsu with PoF is a million times stronger than Gray with PoF. The two aren't even comparable
3. Before Natsu got his PoF boost Zeref revealed that he was only playing with him, so you can't use any of those feats to downplay him.

I'm done with this debate. There's no point in it because Zeref will still get more votes than Invel assuming the last chapter hasn't made everyone in the fanbase hate Zeref to the extent I'm seeing in this thread.

i dont see how this is hate (although i do but i also hate natsu because i use facts and logic to justified my arguments)
i hate natsu but natsu has the feats that are god like i cant deny that but zeref does not. give me an impressive feat zeref has??

how isnt that comparable??? he went from struggling with invel with ds form to base punches that no diff invel. same logic with natsu POF is POF.

he was toying around?? what just tanking his attacks?? (base form in fact) natsu didnt use fdkm nor DF till zeref received FH and look what happened. tanking ig flames is irrevelent because base natsu>ingeel anyways.

i dont want turn it to a erza vs august debate but that like saying pof erza>august because its erza logic.

yes i know that zeref will win this round because people believe in his false hype(not trying to disrespect any1 tho) but it is what it is.

i want to know ur logic bro u have to pick one and stick with it bro. most of the time i agree with u but this time i cant i see it how it is and i cant use false hype to bail zeref out.

Hermit · May 21, 2017

Laxus pwns natsu said:
i dont see how this is hate (although i do but i also hate natsu because i use facts and logic to justified my arguments)
i hate natsu but natsu has the feats that are god like i cant deny that but zeref does not. give me an impressive feat zeref has??

how isnt that comparable??? he went from struggling with invel with ds form to base punches that no diff invel. same logic with natsu POF is POF.

he was toying around?? what just tanking his attacks?? (base form in fact) natsu didnt use fdkm nor DF till zeref received FH and look what happened. tanking ig flames is irrevelent because base natsu>ingeel anyways.

i dont want turn it to a erza vs august debate but that like saying pof erza>august because its erza logic.

yes i know that zeref will win this round because people believe in his false hype(not trying to disrespect any1 tho) but it is what it is.

i want to know ur logic bro u have to pick one and stick with it bro. most of the time i agree with u but this time i cant i see it how it is and i cant use false hype to bait zeref out.

He paralyzes Invel like he did Natsu before, something which Natsu had to enter Dragon Force to overcome.
Invel doesn't have the means to escape a spell like that.
Once Invel is paralyzed, Zeref uses a death Orb on him like those he used in Tenrou on Ultear. Or he simply does to Invel what he did to the Book of E.N.D.
This is just one of the many, many ways Zeref wins this fight.
No matter how you cut it, there's honestly no way Invel wins this.

Invel > Zeref · May 21, 2017

Emperor Spriggan said:
He paralyzes Invel like he did Natsu before, something which Natsu had to enter Dragon Force to overcome.
Invel doesn't have the means to escape a spell like that.
Once Invel is paralyzed, Zeref uses a death Orb on him like those he used in Tenrou on Ultear. Or he simply does to Invel what he did to the Book of E.N.D.
This is just one of the many, many ways Zeref wins this fight.
No matter how you cut it, there's honestly no way Invel wins this.

What's stopping Invel from freezing Zeref before Zeref gets the chance too? Then he just need to ice lock him and fight is over. Or Invel can just insta freeze that thing that Zeref used to paralyze Natsu to escape.

Hermit · May 21, 2017

Invel > Zeref said:
Or Invel can just insta freeze that thing that Zeref used to paralyze Natsu to escape.

Because Invel has been shown to freeze things stronger than him before?
Do you honestly believe Invel's ice is that strong? He FROZE Mavis with Fairy Heart in a dormant state in her body, only recently is when Zeref activated it. That same Mavis who was affected by Ars Magia and Irene was handling the magic in her body without any effects on her, so I'm not sure whether that amounts to anything in the long run.

Invel > Zeref said:
Then he just need to ice lock him and fight is over

Ice Lock...in a one on one? Good luck getting someone to partner up with :yodawg

Anyway, this is my last post on the matter. Legit surprised this thread is this active tbh.

EmberSpirit · May 21, 2017

People who downplay Zeref because he lost to Natsu.

Remind you all that Natsu would trash your favorite characters just the same. :yodawg

CaptainTorch · May 21, 2017

Wow... I mean sure, Zeref's defeat was dissapointing, but people are really overreacting. Zeref still remains top tier in the verse, August and Irene might be above him without his immortality. He has been toying with Natsu the whole fight, when he got serious +FH he oneshotted Natsu. Then Natsu used the "Power of the Guild" (which might be Lucy rewriting his book and giving him more power or something), and burns "time itself" and beats Zeref. I mean, this attack was so devastating that it burned Natsu's arm almost to the bone, despite his heat resistance. So Natsu with that attack could beat anyone in the verse, bar Acnologia.
And srsly, this is getting old. When Natsu gets new feats, no matter how ridicilous they are, people start downplaying Natsu's opponent.
Natsu one-shotting a god? That just means the God was fodder.
Jacob gets one punched by FDKM Natsu? That just means Jacob's durability is shit.
Natsu one-shotting enchanted Neinhart in base? That just means it's a plot hole.
Natsu gets a BS powerup in base, and defeats FH Zeref(while getting his hand burned to a crisp)? That just means Zeref is low-tier spriggan
:notrust

I can understand the hate, but it isn't a reason to downplay a character.

Jean Grey · May 21, 2017

EmberSpirit said:
People who downplay Zeref because he lost to Natsu.

Remind you all that Natsu would trash your favorite characters just the same.

You're right.

Natsu no diffs everyone.

Those who survive against Natsu even a second is a God tier.

Changing my vote to Zeref.

Crescent Jinx · May 21, 2017

Really? People are debating this...?And it's 3 pages long....

I don't ever comment on this tournament or power scaling cuz I don't care... but the argument I am seeing here is similar to the owl guy eating Natsu in ToH.

He ate Natsu and Gray had to beat him. But then Natsu beat Jellal. So owl guy is stronger than Jellal because he beat Natsu.

Except change Zeref for Jellal and InVel for owl guy.

EmberSpirit · May 21, 2017

Jean Grey said:
You're right.

Natsu no diffs everyone.

Those who survive against Natsu even a second is a God tier.

Changing my vote to Zeref.

Smart man. Zeref lasted long enough against Natsu, no one else would last more than 2 chapters. Even Acnologia fight is doubtful that it will be 5+ chapters. :kappa

Invel > Zeref · May 21, 2017

Emperor Spriggan said:
Because Invel has been shown to freeze things stronger than him before?
Do you honestly believe Invel's ice is that strong? He FROZE Mavis with Fairy Heart in a dormant state in her body, only recently is when Zeref activated it. That same Mavis who was affected by Ars Magia and Irene was handling the magic in her body without any effects on her, so I'm not sure whether that amounts to anything in the long run.

Ice Lock...in a one on one? Good luck getting someone to partner up with
Anyway, this is my last post on the matter. Legit surprised this thread is this active tbh.

Base Natsu is clearly stronger than him yet Invel still froze him just like how Larcade's hax still worked on Zeref. You don't need a partner for ice lock. Invel just did that to drive Gray mad. I don't think ice lock is useful when a character is on guard but I do believe that Invel can freeze Zeref long enough to ice lock him which was proven to work on people with large magic power. Is there any proof that ars magia wouldn't work on Zeref but August still used it because he knew that Zeref would still regenerate?

Takuan · May 21, 2017

Damn, just like my boy @Emperor Spriggan, im surprised this thread is discussed that much. I thought the choice was pretty obvious, and well, i still think it is. Zeref is the obvious winner.

So now Invel can insta freeze Zeref, that's new. I guess Jacob wins against Zeref by clapping his hands. Next time i'll read that Ajeel wins against Zeref because he has no way to deal with Sandworld.
Almost reminiscent of how ridiculous some Mira discussions can be when people argue about her level based on Macro. Sorry to break it to you but Invel ain't insta freezing Zeref.

The reality is that Zeref, even without immortality and despite poor feats, is way above low-medium tier Spriggans. Saying characters like those i mentionned, Ajeel, Bradman, Jacob, or in this case Invel, would stand a chance is preposterous.

Invel > Zeref · May 21, 2017

I have been doing my best to provide logic as to why I think Invel will win yet many others seem to just brush it off as me overreacting to the latest chapter or they just use hype as justification for Zeref to be stronger instead of refuting my points. Unlike other Spriggans, Invel actually has the feat of temporarily incapacitating base Natsu, who was just proven to be the strongest fire mage in existence, so I see no reason why freezing wouldn't work on Zeref for a long enough time for Invel to get the win.

Plus Zeref was getting frozen and was visibly getting nervous from Gray's Iced Shell. Considering that Invel's ice armor would have frozen an Ice Devil Slayer solid if he didn't manage to reshape it, I don't see that ice as being much weaker than the iced shell that would have incapacitated Zeref. Hence, it seems obvious that Invel would win.

LaGOAT · May 22, 2017

Emperor Spriggan said:
He paralyzes Invel like he did Natsu before, something which Natsu had to enter Dragon Force to overcome.
Invel doesn't have the means to escape a spell like that.
Once Invel is paralyzed, Zeref uses a death Orb on him like those he used in Tenrou on Ultear. Or he simply does to Invel what he did to the Book of E.N.D.
This is just one of the many, many ways Zeref wins this fight.
No matter how you cut it, there's honestly no way Invel wins this.

He instafreeze base natsu what r taking about?? and natsu>Invel so zeref get insta freeze same logic apply here lacarde hax works on top tiers so logic is debunked. he doesn't have to kill him plus his instafrezze is faster than his parlaying spell again DF natsu is irrelevant when base natsu>DF natsu. death orbs??? :yodawg

A feat that tenrou ultear could dodge r u gonna say that would stop invel :yodawg

lol funny and please give more feats that zeref have that can beat invel. I'll be waiting