Character Speculative Tier List

[Hardy]

As long as you keep it civil, go wild here.

Feel free to use doubles players or "Come on, Ryoga is clearly the final boss" or "Medanore scales with Volk" as arguments. As long as it's reasonable, it's fine.

For the moment, I'm sharing the list from the other thread as a base, but please include other players that did not fit the other criteria.

Spoiler: U-17 Singles Revised (In Progress)

Alphabetical order within individual tiers.

S Tier (Top of the World)

Byoudouin
Volk

A+ Tier
Echizen Ryoga
QP
Oni

A Tier (High Pro Level)

Atobe
Amadeus
Bismarck
Fernandez
Rhinehart
Tanegashima
Tezuka
Tokugawa
Watanabe
Zeus

B Tier (TnK Rally)

Akutsu
Chardard
Delon
Dorgias
Echizen Ryoma
Fuji
Irie
Sanada
Shiraishi
Siegfried
Toyama
Yukimura

C Tier
Hakamada
Krauser
Momoshiro
Nakagauchi
Oshitari Y.
Sengoku
Yamato

Spoiler: Prefecturals - Tokyo - Kanto - Nationals

Prefectural Tournament
(Chapters 1 - 40)

High

Echizen Ryoma

Mid

Ibu Shinji
Inui Sadaharu
Kaidoh Kaoru
Kamio Akira

Low

Arai Masashi
Sasabe


Tokyo Tournament
(Chapters 41 - 109)

High

Akutsu Jin
Echizen Ryoma
Fuji Shuuske

Mid

Momoshiro Takeshi
Sengoku Kiyosumi

Low

Fuji Yuuta
Mizuki Hajime


Kanto Tournament
(Chapters 110 - 236)

High

Echizen Ryoma
Sanada Gen'ichirou

Upper Mid

Atobe Keigo
Fuji Shuusuke
Inui Sadaharu
Kirihara Akaya
Tezuka Kunimitsu
Yanagi Renji

Lower Mid

Akutagawa Jiro
Aoi Kentarou
Hiyoshi Wakashi
Kamio Akira
Kaidoh Kaoru
Kiraku Yasuyuki
Sengoku Kiyosumi

Low

Kawamura Takashi


National Tournament
(Chapters 237-379)

S Tier

Echizen Ryoma

A Tier

Yukimura Seiichi

B Tier

Fuji Shuusuke
Sanada Gen'ichirou
Tezuka Kunimitsu
Tooyama Kintarou

C Tier

Atobe Keigo
Chitose Senri
Kirihara Akaya
Kite Eishirou
Niou Masaharu
Shiraishi Kuranosuke
Tachibana Kippei

D Tier

Ishida Gin
Liliadent Krauser
Momoshiro Takeshi
Oshitari Yuushi

E Tier

Chinen Hiroshi
Kai Yuujirou
Kikumaru Eiji
Tanishi Kei

F Tier

Aoi Kentarou
Kawamura Takashi
Saeki Kojirou

---‐---

Spoiler: First post

Gonna throw something for the very top of the list to start the discussion:

Newcomers are bolded
^Raised compared to the other list
>Lowered compared to the other list

S Tier (Top of the World)

Byoudouin
Medanore
Echizen Ryoga^
Volk J.

A+ Tier
QP
Oni
Tokugawa^

A Tier (High Pro Level)

Atobe
Amadeus
Camus
Fernandez (here just because of next month)
Rhinehart
Tanegashima
Tezuka
Volk B.
Watanabe

A- Tier (Pro Level)
Balentien
Bismarck>
Echizen Ryoma^
Fuji^
Kirihara
Hopkins
Obando
Ranbiell
Tatsuta
Yukimura^
Zeus>

...or something like that.

 

[mathematicianrcg]

2-Tokugawa cannot use Black Hole for 2 straight sets. I'd have Byoudouin on a tier of his own, if anything.

6-I'd have Duke next to Tanegashima in every list.

7-Ryoma being a whole tier above Fuji doesn't make sense right now.

9-Shiraishi said Kintarou would likely lose to Ryoma so I'd have Fuji right under Yukimura but above the rest.

I'd probably have Kaji and Ohmagari here, btw.

12-We had agreed that Irie beats Yukimura in the other thread.

The tier of 13-15 shouldn't exist imo. I'd move all of them.

13-Akutsu was in 8C for a whole hour (and that rally only lasted that long because he wanted to surprise Amadeus). That's likely longer than what Atobe lasted in his Evolution self. I'd rank them the same way.

14-Ochi is kinda impossible to rank since he can only use Mach sparingly or his arm dies. I'd just put him above Mouri and call it a day.

15-Kirihara's Blue Eyed mode has like the best scoring feat in the series except for Volk vs Byoudouin (imo) and doesn't have the time limit nor the stamina issues the incomplete version had at the start of his match. I'd say he can probably beat Sanada nowadays but we won't get to see it. Fuji even said Kirihara would win against him (even if this is played for laughs, odds are they are pretty close in tiers).

17-Tohno is pretty much retired so he should go last. I'm not sure if he can stay on the court for 2 sets alone.

18-Kimijima kept his serve playing pretty much alone against the French D2, his tennis is legit. Also, I'm not sure how effective Mouri's current tennis is in singles? He can just cover the net in doubles but that strategy shouldn't work as well playing alone. I'd have him above Mouri (and Ochi).

19 and 20 are interchangeable imo. That said I'd have Hakamada and Date above them.

With Yanagi/Kite:
Chitose
Tachibana
Nakagauchi
Yuushi

-Gap

Sengoku?
Ishida? (Nationals! Shiraishi could return the 108 Hadou and he likely had something like 3/3/3/3/3 in stats which is rather low. A 1 in Speed is inexcusable and would be exploited in singles. He cannot spam Hadous for 3 sets. If not for the KO threat I'd have him last.)
Marui (only 2 in power)
Niou? (only 2 in power, no copies)
Oishi

So in other words

You still have the whole Genius 5

(Byo, Toku, Oni, Tane, and Duke) stronger than all Japanese Rep Msers?


As for Tokugawa. I mean he dominated Duke when he got serious. So I think He is a tier above Oni/Tane/Duke Tier. (Maybe Oni is same tier as Toku)

Aren't you the one who argued against Fuji back then? And said that the only reason why Fuji would have won is because Ryoma wanted to face and return the counters directly? Instead of just going for the kill right away?

Also, We know Ryoma will beat Yukimura. But Yukimura will absolutely low diff Fuji.
(But maybe it's just a matchup thing cause Fuji have no counter against Yips/Dream?)

Maybe the 3 of them are same tier.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 11, 2024, Original Post Date: Jan 11, 2024 ---

2-Tokugawa cannot use Black Hole for 2 straight sets. I'd have Byoudouin on a tier of his own, if anything.

6-I'd have Duke next to Tanegashima in every list.

7-Ryoma being a whole tier above Fuji doesn't make sense right now.

9-Shiraishi said Kintarou would likely lose to Ryoma so I'd have Fuji right under Yukimura but above the rest.

I'd probably have Kaji and Ohmagari here, btw.

12-We had agreed that Irie beats Yukimura in the other thread.

The tier of 13-15 shouldn't exist imo. I'd move all of them.

13-Akutsu was in 8C for a whole hour (and that rally only lasted that long because he wanted to surprise Amadeus). That's likely longer than what Atobe lasted in his Evolution self. I'd rank them the same way.

14-Ochi is kinda impossible to rank since he can only use Mach sparingly or his arm dies. I'd just put him above Mouri and call it a day.

15-Kirihara's Blue Eyed mode has like the best scoring feat in the series except for Volk vs Byoudouin (imo) and doesn't have the time limit nor the stamina issues the incomplete version had at the start of his match. I'd say he can probably beat Sanada nowadays but we won't get to see it. Fuji even said Kirihara would win against him (even if this is played for laughs, odds are they are pretty close in tiers).

17-Tohno is pretty much retired so he should go last. I'm not sure if he can stay on the court for 2 sets alone.

18-Kimijima kept his serve playing pretty much alone against the French D2, his tennis is legit. Also, I'm not sure how effective Mouri's current tennis is in singles? He can just cover the net in doubles but that strategy shouldn't work as well playing alone. I'd have him above Mouri (and Ochi).

19 and 20 are interchangeable imo. That said I'd have Hakamada and Date above them.

With Yanagi/Kite:
Chitose
Tachibana
Nakagauchi
Yuushi

-Gap

Sengoku?
Ishida? (Nationals! Shiraishi could return the 108 Hadou and he likely had something like 3/3/3/3/3 in stats which is rather low. A 1 in Speed is inexcusable and would be exploited in singles. He cannot spam Hadous for 3 sets. If not for the KO threat I'd have him last.)
Marui (only 2 in power)
Niou? (only 2 in power, no copies)
Oishi

How strong is Irie anyways.

If he beats Yukimura.

That means Irie will beat Sanada and Fuji.

But We also agreed that Ryoma beats Irie?

But we agreed Irie Beats Yuki who we agree beats Fuji who should be same level as Ryoma?

Is that a matchup thingy again?

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 11, 2024 ---

2-Tokugawa cannot use Black Hole for 2 straight sets. I'd have Byoudouin on a tier of his own, if anything.

6-I'd have Duke next to Tanegashima in every list.

7-Ryoma being a whole tier above Fuji doesn't make sense right now.

9-Shiraishi said Kintarou would likely lose to Ryoma so I'd have Fuji right under Yukimura but above the rest.

I'd probably have Kaji and Ohmagari here, btw.

12-We had agreed that Irie beats Yukimura in the other thread.

The tier of 13-15 shouldn't exist imo. I'd move all of them.

13-Akutsu was in 8C for a whole hour (and that rally only lasted that long because he wanted to surprise Amadeus). That's likely longer than what Atobe lasted in his Evolution self. I'd rank them the same way.

14-Ochi is kinda impossible to rank since he can only use Mach sparingly or his arm dies. I'd just put him above Mouri and call it a day.

15-Kirihara's Blue Eyed mode has like the best scoring feat in the series except for Volk vs Byoudouin (imo) and doesn't have the time limit nor the stamina issues the incomplete version had at the start of his match. I'd say he can probably beat Sanada nowadays but we won't get to see it. Fuji even said Kirihara would win against him (even if this is played for laughs, odds are they are pretty close in tiers).

17-Tohno is pretty much retired so he should go last. I'm not sure if he can stay on the court for 2 sets alone.

18-Kimijima kept his serve playing pretty much alone against the French D2, his tennis is legit. Also, I'm not sure how effective Mouri's current tennis is in singles? He can just cover the net in doubles but that strategy shouldn't work as well playing alone. I'd have him above Mouri (and Ochi).

19 and 20 are interchangeable imo. That said I'd have Hakamada and Date above them.

With Yanagi/Kite:
Chitose
Tachibana
Nakagauchi
Yuushi

-Gap

Sengoku?
Ishida? (Nationals! Shiraishi could return the 108 Hadou and he likely had something like 3/3/3/3/3 in stats which is rather low. A 1 in Speed is inexcusable and would be exploited in singles. He cannot spam Hadous for 3 sets. If not for the KO threat I'd have him last.)
Marui (only 2 in power)
Niou? (only 2 in power, no copies)
Oishi

Ohmagari is weak in Singles though. Thats why he was never put in Singles.
He is always in doubles. Tanegashima Low diffed him in Singles. And even if he trained his whole time to beat Tane. He can only do that in Doubles.

Heck, he cannot even return Sanada's Simple Double Slash.

What? You have Kimijama over Ochi???

 

[Hardy]

So in other words

You still have the whole Genius 5

(Byo, Toku, Oni, Tane, and Duke) stronger than all Japanese Rep Msers?


As for Tokugawa. I mean he dominated Duke when he got serious. So I think He is a tier above Oni/Tane/Duke Tier. (Maybe Oni is same tier as Toku)

Aren't you the one who argued against Fuji back then? And said that the only reason why Fuji would have won is because Ryoma wanted to face and return the counters directly? Instead of just going for the kill right away?

Also, We know Ryoma will beat Yukimura. But Yukimura will absolutely low diff Fuji.
(But maybe it's just a matchup thing cause Fuji have no counter against Yips/Dream?)

Maybe the 3 of them are same tier.

Yukimura admitted that Tokugawa and Duke were on a different level even BEFORE the latter revealed he had a Ki Jin. So... yeah, MSers stand no chance. Only Atobe and Akutsu for a set because of their feats against Romeo and Amadeus.

Tokugawa was always serious, he just "unlocked" a new use of Black Hole. Black Hole still has a time limit, that hasn't changed, so if he needs it for 3 sets in order to win then he's done. I'd even argue that Duke is still better.

I think Ryoma is better than Fuji but not a whole tier better. Also, I guess he has yet to dominate his Samurai and cannot use it at will + if Fuji knew the SSS his Hope would be useless.

Yukimura can beat players that are potentially better than him thanks to Yips + can steal their future. Ryoma has a direct counter so the first part doesn't apply + Yukimura said himself that he needs to be in top mental form in order to compete for the S2 spot. Fuji has no counters for Yips, unfortunately for him. Perhaps if it's a single set he can win.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 11, 2024, Original Post Date: Jan 11, 2024 ---

Ohmagari is weak in Singles though. Thats why he was never put in Singles.
He is always in doubles. Tanegashima Low diffed him in Singles. And even if he trained his whole time to beat Tane. He can only do that in Doubles.

Heck, he cannot even return Sanada's Simple Double Slash.

What? You have Kimijama over Ochi???

Why is Ohmagari weak in Singles? He's never put in Singles because he has a ton of experience in doubles and his skillset is great for it.

Tanegashima can low diff 90% of the cast so it's not really worth much. Also that was years ago, we don't know how it'd had gone before Tanegashima unlocked the Ultimate Void.

There's a decent chance he was playing at 60% against Sanada. We don't know if he wouldn't have adapted to the Clutch, either, he barely got to see it. His stats are better than Tokugawa's, who won comfortably against Sanada while holding back.

Kimijima is ranked above Ochi. If the latter could use Mach every game I'd easily invert the order, but he cannot.

 

[mathematicianrcg]

Yukimura admitted that Tokugawa and Duke were on a different level even BEFORE the latter revealed he had a Ki Jin. So... yeah, MSers stand no chance. Only Atobe and Akutsu for a set because of their feats against Romeo and Amadeus.

Tokugawa was always serious, he just "unlocked" a new use of Black Hole. Black Hole still has a time limit, that hasn't changed, so if he needs it for 3 sets in order to win then he's done. I'd even argue that Duke is still better.

I think Ryoma is better than Fuji but not a whole tier better. Also, I guess he has yet to dominate his Samurai and cannot use it at will + if Fuji knew the SSS his Hope would be useless.

Yukimura can beat players that are potentially better than him thanks to Yips + can steal their future. Ryoma has a direct counter so the first part doesn't apply + Yukimura said himself that he needs to be in top mental form in order to compete for the S2 spot. Fuji has no counters for Yips, unfortunately for him. Perhaps if it's a single set he can win.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 11, 2024, Original Post Date: Jan 11, 2024 ---

Why is Ohmagari weak in Singles? He's never put in Singles because he has a ton of experience in doubles and his skillset is great for it.

Tanegashima can low diff 90% of the cast so it's not really worth much. Also that was years ago, we don't know how it'd had gone before Tanegashima unlocked the Ultimate Void.

There's a decent chance he was playing at 60% against Sanada. We don't know if he wouldn't have adapted to the Clutch, either, he barely got to see it. His stats are better than Tokugawa's, who won comfortably against Sanada while holding back.

Kimijima is ranked above Ochi. If the latter could use Mach every game I'd easily invert the order, but he cannot.

I wonder how Japan Genius 10 badges work.

We all assumed they are just playing each other in singles. And the winner will get the higher badge

However, Ohmagari just said recently that the only reason he is #6 is because Tanegashima Carried him. (He always invert his badge because he thinks he only deserved #9?)

Doesn't it imply they play doubles too? Because how can Tanegashima carried him?

Or maybe the badge switching can happen in doubles too. Lol

Maybe Ohmagari was not stronger than former #6. Tanegashima was just the best player on the court. And since Tane already have #2. Tane just gave #6 to Ohmagari. Lmao.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 11, 2024 ---

I dont know how

Ochi being fomer #4 goes all the way down to #9???

What?

I can understand the returning G5 will push him down.

But for Ohmagari, Kimijama, and even Tohno to have higher badge than him is a mystery.

During the Recent Intra Match,

Ochi/Mouri beats Kimijama/Tohno

And Ochi was obviously the best player on the Court

And When Oishi asked how did the lower ranked doubles pair won. Someone in Hsers said something like it is because Ochi was actually the best player on the court and former #4.

So, how did he fell to #9?

 

[Hardy]

I wonder how Japan Genius 10 badges work.

We all assumed they are just playing each other in singles. And the winner will get the higher badge

However, Ohmagari just said recently that the only reason he is #6 is because Tanegashima Carried him. (He always invert his badge because he thinks he only deserved #9?)

Doesn't it imply they play doubles too? Because how can Tanegashima carried him?

Or maybe the badge switching can happen in doubles too. Lol

Maybe Ohmagari was not stronger than former #6. Tanegashima was just the best player on the court. And since Tane already have #2. Tane just gave #6 to Ohmagari. Lmao.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 11, 2024 ---

I dont know how

Ochi being fomer #4 goes all the way down to #9???

What?

I can understand the returning G5 will plave him down.

But for Ohmagari, Kimijama, and even Tohno to have higher badge than him is a mystery.

During the Recent Intra Match,

Ochi/Mouri beats Kimijama/Tohno

And Ochi was obviously the best player on the Court

And When Oishi asked how did the lower ranked doubles pair won. Someone in Hsers said it is because Ochi was actually the best player on the court and former #4.

So, how did he fell to #9?

Yeah, I guess you can rank up with singles, doubles or team shuffles.

I'd think Ohmagari and Tanegashima beat the former 5th and 6th and then they went up like that. Then, in his quest to get the number 1 spot Tanegashima kept climbing on his own, but Ohmagari remained at 6th. Or they were something like 9 and 10 and every person above them is now in university, so they went up automatically.

The #9 thing was just me brainstorming theories. He thinks he doesn't deserve his badge but that doesn't mean he's fine with #9 or belongs to that spot.

There's a chance Ochi dropped from the G-10 altogether and only recently got back into it by exclusively playing doubles with Mouri (the coaches paired them together at the start of this year).

We don't know if Ochi was the best player on the court. The whole match was off-screened. Ochi-Mouri have a much better doubles bonus than Kimijima-Tohno + they win every Ochi game thanks to Mach, and even then the match went to the tie-breaker.

 

[mathematicianrcg]

Going back to Kimijama

I wonder what he has aside from his negotiations. Lol

He literally negotiates using words and manipulation to let him win, or make his opponent's go easy. Basically a Lower Version of Osval's 5 Chariot Technique? Lmao.

As for his tennis skills. All he have is that 13 Lyrics Song. He revealed 3 of them which are just defensive and net moves.

I wonder if the other 10 Lyrics are attack style shots.

 

[LetalHawk]

Going back to Kimijama

I wonder what he has aside from his negotiations. Lol

He literally negotiates using words and manipulation to let him win, or make his opponent's go easy. Basically a Lower Version of Osval's 5 Chariot Technique? Lmao.

As for his tennis skills. All he have is that 13 Lyrics Song. He revealed 3 of them which are just defensive and net moves.

I wonder if the other 10 Lyrics are attack style shots.

He isn’t that impressive, most Msers smoke him easily nowadays.

 

[mathematicianrcg]

He isn’t that impressive, most Msers smoke him easily nowadays.

I mean Only the Genius 5 can be argued as on another level.

Duke is the weakest among the 5. And he is the former #1 Player of #3 Ranked France.
(Actually #2 if Camus was already there 2 years ago). And Duke will still be the second strongest Player in France if he chose to play for them this year

Top Msers is in IRIE Category now.

Ryoma and Atobe probably beats Irie now. But still slightly below Duke

Yukimura, Sanada, Kintarou, Fuji is same level as Irie now at worst probably.

 

[Hardy]

Top Msers is in IRIE Category now.

Ryoma and Atobe probably beats Irie now. But still slightly below Duke

Yukimura, Sanada, Kintarou, Fuji is same level as Irie now at worst probably.

But Irie walked over Kaji and was beating Atobe handily before even revealing he could use TnK. Under what premise can we say someone like Sanada is at his level?

 

[LetalHawk]

But Irie walked over Kaji and was beating Atobe handily before even revealing he could use TnK. Under what premise can we say someone like Sanada is at his level?

Isn’t Atobe currently above Irie? I also have Ryoma and Kin above him too.

 

[Hardy]

Isn’t Atobe currently above Irie? I also have Ryoma and Kin above him too.

He probably is but it doesn't change much, I'm talking about !Selection Atobe.

What have Ryoma and Kin shown for them to be ahead of Irie?

 

[LetalHawk]

He probably is but it doesn't change much, I'm talking about !Selection Atobe.

What have Ryoma and Kin shown for them to be ahead of Irie?

Ryoma Samurai+TnK+Kijin. In the match up thread we had him comfortably defeating Irie so it doesn’t change the fact that he is stronger than him currently, and after the finals he will be by a large margin.

Kintarou is aiming more for doubles but with TnK and his power can definitely beat Irie. I don’t see how Irie cannot be beaten by Kin.

 

[Hardy]

Ryoma Samurai+TnK+Kijin. In the match up thread we had him comfortably defeating Irie so it doesn’t change the fact that he is stronger than him currently, and after the finals he will be by a large margin.

Kintarou is aiming more for doubles but with TnK and his power can definitely beat Irie. I don’t see how Irie cannot be beaten by Kin.

At the end of the day those can turn into popularity polls, though. I don't recall reading anything that has Ryoma as clearly a better player.

Samurai is Ki Jin so you are adding 2 of the same. Ryoma didn't use it against Fuji and tenipuri party shows that he seemingly didn't even notice both him and Ludwig were doing a Samurai vs Knight duel, so he very clearly hasn't dominated it.

Irie won against Date who has a 6 in Power (Kin has 5 as of 10.5), Power alone won't cut it.

 

[mathematicianrcg]

At the end of the day those can turn into popularity polls, though. I don't recall reading anything that has Ryoma as clearly a better player.

Samurai is Ki Jin so you are adding 2 of the same. Ryoma didn't use it against Fuji and tenipuri party shows that he seemingly didn't even notice both him and Ludwig were doing a Samurai vs Knight duel, so he very clearly hasn't dominated it.

Irie won against Date who has a 6 in Power (Kin has 5 as of 10.5), Power alone won't cut it.

I don't think we are turning it into popularity contest. Ryoma is like 10x more popular than Duke. Duke still won.
(And we are always labeling Duke as the weakest G5 member)

As for Irie. What is his best feat?

Beating former #5 Kaji coming from an Injury?
(Tbh, Idk how to scale Kaji cause his stats doesnt measure up to his showings. He was Dominated by Genius 10 arc Oni at BASE!!!)

AS for Msers

Kintarou Convincingly defeated Australia's #1.

Sanada Dominated France's #2

Ryoma Won against France's #3. Without using all of his arsenals.

Yukimura was able to put Tezuka in the edge. In which Tezuka was forced to unlock his Ultimate Zone and Zero Shiki Variations.
(And still Tezuka had trouble against Dream)
------
I know to there are different contexts and matchup thingy around those. But still, those are feats.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 12, 2024, Original Post Date: Jan 12, 2024 ---

Irie won against Date who has a 6 in Power (Kin has 5 as of 10.5), Power alone won't cut it.

As for stats. I don't know how accurate is that in relation to a faceoff or battle.

Tristan and Timothe both have 30 total stats.

But somehow Kimijama who have 25 total stats can 1 V 2 them? .

(Or Maybe Tristan/Timothe held back.)

 

[Hardy]

I don't think we are turning it into popularity contest. Ryoma is like 10x more popular than Duke. Duke still won.
(And we are always labeling Duke as the weakest G5 member)

As for Irie. What is his best feat?

Beating former #5 Kaji coming from an Injury?
(Tbh, Idk how to scale Kaji cause his stats doesnt measure up to his showings. He was Dominated by Genius 10 arc Oni at BASE!!!)

AS for Msers

Kintarou Convincingly defeated Australia's #1.

Sanada Dominated France's #2

Ryoma Won against France's #3. Without using all of his arsenals.

Yukimura was able to put Tezuka in the edge. In which Tezuka was forced to unlock his Ultimate Zone and Zero Shiki Variations.
(And still Tezuka had trouble against Dream)
------
I know to there are different contexts and matchup thingy around those. But still, those are feats.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 12, 2024, Original Post Date: Jan 12, 2024 ---

As for stats. I don't know how accurate is that in relation to a faceoff or battle.

Tristan and Timothe both have 30 total stats.

But somehow Kimijama who have 25 total stats can 1 V 2 them? .

(Or Maybe Tristan/Timothe held back.)

Not saying they 100% are, but as any poll they are certainly not definitive. Even then Duke vs Ryoma should had been kinda easy since we were told in the same match that the top MSers don't have that S1 level yet, but many still argued for Ryoma.

Kaji wasn't "dominated" by Base Oni. Oni went all out and unexpectedly one shot him with Ki Jin + GJK (move that was relevant enough to be used in the match against QP). He had developed a new move and he didn't get to use it lol.

Irie's biggest feat is destroying Atobe and then activating TnK just to dunk on him harder. The one that saw through Materializar was him, too.

We don't know how any of those scale vs Irie except maybe JJ. For all we know Irie is stronger than all of them.

Kintarou didn't convincingly defeat Dorgias, in the fanbooks he doesn't even consider it a win because of how it ended. Australia is a poor team and being their best player isn't that great of a feat (and there's a chance Crawford was Australia's best singles player since the fanbooks describe him as their ace). Nevermind the fact that BASE Irie (not even TnK Irie) walked over Atobe and in the next day Atobe was going head to head against Dorgias himself.

We don't know how strong the ninja was. Also, a big part of Sanada winning there was the fact that Shadow countered his opponent perfectly. Imagine that Seda can hypnotise Amadeus but not Kintarou, does that mean that the latter is surely better?

Ryoma did that then a couple of days later against Fuji he limited himself to TnK. Either because he can't control what he used against France (Allez and Samurai) or because it wasn't worth it if Fuji knew the SSS (Hope).

Yukimura admitted that he needed to be in top mental form to win the S2 spot and that the S1 race was in another league compared to his level.

Stats do matter. Generally whoever has higher stats is better. The ranking of the HSers in Japan directly correlates to their totals (with minor exceptions). The current MSers are also the strongest based on stats, too (like I said in another thread, the ONE non selected player with a higher total compared to Sengoku is Kenya; maybe they played each other and the Yamabuki rep won thanks to his experience playing Kamio and Sakata?).

We are told that, when attacking, spikes are better and Kimijima has a 7 in Mental, ahead of both French reps' 6 (and I imagine that's how he kept his serve, considering serving also gives you a boost). Irie has crazy spikes and has shown he can win against someone that is much stronger in his weak points (Date).

 

[mathematicianrcg]

MY UPDATED SPECULATED TOP 10 PLAYERS IN THE TOURNEY (As of Finals D2)

1. Ryoga (Obvious Reasons)
2. Medanore (I think he finally Surpass Volk)
3. Volk
4. Byoudouin
5. QP/Tokugawa
6. Oni/
7. Ralph
8. Amadeus
9. Zeus/Tanegashima
10. Bismarck/Camus/Tezuka/Atobe/Romeo

PS: Who did I forgot?

--- Double Post Merged, Feb 11, 2024, Original Post Date: Feb 7, 2024 ---

As long as you keep it civil, go wild here.

Feel free to use doubles players or "Come on, Ryoga is clearly the final boss" or "Medanore scales with Volk" as arguments. As long as it's reasonable, it's fine.

For the moment, I'm sharing the list from the other thread as a base, but please include other players that did not fit the other criteria.

Spoiler: U-17 Singles Revised (In Progress)

Alphabetical order within individual tiers.

S Tier (Top of the World)

Byoudouin
Volk

A+ Tier
Echizen Ryoga
QP
Oni

A Tier (High Pro Level)

Atobe
Amadeus
Bismarck
Fernandez
Rhinehart
Tanegashima
Tezuka
Tokugawa
Watanabe
Zeus

B Tier (TnK Rally)

Akutsu
Chardard
Delon
Dorgias
Echizen Ryoma
Fuji
Irie
Sanada
Shiraishi
Siegfried
Toyama
Yukimura

C Tier
Hakamada
Krauser
Momoshiro
Nakagauchi
Oshitari Y.
Sengoku
Yamato

Spoiler: Prefecturals - Tokyo - Kanto - Nationals

Prefectural Tournament
(Chapters 1 - 40)

High

Echizen Ryoma

Mid

Ibu Shinji
Inui Sadaharu
Kaidoh Kaoru
Kamio Akira

Low

Arai Masashi
Sasabe


Tokyo Tournament
(Chapters 41 - 109)

High

Akutsu Jin
Echizen Ryoma
Fuji Shuuske

Mid

Momoshiro Takeshi
Sengoku Kiyosumi

Low

Fuji Yuuta
Mizuki Hajime


Kanto Tournament
(Chapters 110 - 236)

High

Echizen Ryoma
Sanada Gen'ichirou

Upper Mid

Atobe Keigo
Fuji Shuusuke
Inui Sadaharu
Kirihara Akaya
Tezuka Kunimitsu
Yanagi Renji

Lower Mid

Akutagawa Jiro
Aoi Kentarou
Hiyoshi Wakashi
Kamio Akira
Kaidoh Kaoru
Kiraku Yasuyuki
Sengoku Kiyosumi

Low

Kawamura Takashi


National Tournament
(Chapters 237-379)

S Tier

Echizen Ryoma

A Tier

Yukimura Seiichi

B Tier

Fuji Shuusuke
Sanada Gen'ichirou
Tezuka Kunimitsu
Tooyama Kintarou

C Tier

Atobe Keigo
Chitose Senri
Kirihara Akaya
Kite Eishirou
Niou Masaharu
Shiraishi Kuranosuke
Tachibana Kippei

D Tier

Ishida Gin
Liliadent Krauser
Momoshiro Takeshi
Oshitari Yuushi

E Tier

Chinen Hiroshi
Kai Yuujirou
Kikumaru Eiji
Tanishi Kei

F Tier

Aoi Kentarou
Kawamura Takashi
Saeki Kojirou

---‐---

Spoiler: First post

Gonna throw something for the very top of the list to start the discussion:

Newcomers are bolded
^Raised compared to the other list
>Lowered compared to the other list

S Tier (Top of the World)

Byoudouin
Medanore
Echizen Ryoga^
Volk J.

A+ Tier
QP
Oni
Tokugawa^

A Tier (High Pro Level)

Atobe
Amadeus
Camus
Fernandez (here just because of next month)
Rhinehart
Tanegashima
Tezuka
Volk B.
Watanabe

A- Tier (Pro Level)
Balentien
Bismarck>
Echizen Ryoma^
Fuji^
Kirihara
Hopkins
Obando
Ranbiell
Tatsuta
Yukimura^
Zeus>

...or something like that.

I will update my own Tier list

S Tier - Ryoga, Medanore, Volk, Byoudouin

A++ Tier - QP with UA

A+ Tier - Ralph, Amadeus, Bismarck, Tokugawa, Oni, Zeus, Tanegashima, Tezuka, Romeo, Camus

A Tier - Duke, , Irie, Atobe, Ryoma, Fuji, Kintarou, Yukimura, Sanada, Akutsu

 

[LetalHawk]

MY UPDATED SPECULATED TOP 10 PLAYERS IN THE TOURNEY (As of Finals D2)

1. Ryoga (Obvious Reasons)
2. Medanore (I think he finally Surpass Volk)
3. Volk
4. Byoudouin
5. QP/Tokugawa
6. Oni/
7. Ralph
8. Amadeus
9. Zeus/Tanegashima
10. Bismarck/Camus/Tezuka/Atobe/Romeo

PS: Who did I forgot?

--- Double Post Merged, Feb 11, 2024, Original Post Date: Feb 7, 2024 ---

I will update my own Tier list

S Tier - Ryoga, Medanore, Volk, Byoudouin

A++ Tier - QP with UA

A+ Tier - Ralph, Amadeus, Bismarck, Tokugawa, Oni, Zeus, Tanegashima, Tezuka, Romeo, Camus

A Tier - Duke, , Irie, Atobe, Ryoma, Fuji, Kintarou, Yukimura, Sanada, Akutsu

Why not Atobe in A+ tier? His 3rd year Hser version of himself easily is in that level after what he’s shown. While using Infinite evolution he can probably play on par with top pros.

 

[mathematicianrcg]

I decided to rank all Hsers that played already. ( So no Medanore, Tokugawa, Julio, or Silva Yet)

TOP 10 HSERS (That played already on screen in the Tourney)

1. Volk

2. Byoudouin

3.UA QP

4.Ralph

5.Amadeus

6.Zeus

7. Mares (can climb depending next month)

8. Oni

9. Tanegashima

10.Bismarck

Honorable Mentions: Camus, Duke, Albert, Peter. Dorgias, Dodo, Kiko

PS: I might be underrating Camus, but hehas no feats nor hype to back him up. And Duke is also mentioned to have a chance to beat him, and we all know Duke is the weakest g5 Member.

 

[mathematicianrcg]

The Top Tier list look like this:

Monster Quartet: Volk, Medanore, Byoudouin, Ryoga

Next in Line: QP, Ralph, Amadeus, Oni, Tokugawa, Zeus,

 

[Adamska]

The Top Tier list look like this:

Monster Quartet: Volk, Medanore, Byoudouin, Ryoga

Next in Line: QP, Ralph, Amadeus, Oni, Tokugawa, Zeus,

Neither Cameo nor Zeus are not pro.
While Amades/Ralph are.
About Oni, He is not as good as them.
Back 2 years ago Amadeus almost beated Boss who was Japan #1 climbing up to the tower of pros. So no.
Yet, lately I found it very hard to say who is stronger that who!
Specially around G5 (-1).
They are all great. For ex:
I can tell you Mares is better than Bismarck or vice versa.
Anyway, we 3 matches ahead and it's hard to tell if Ryoma puts and end to it or Medanore?

 

[mathematicianrcg]

Neither Cameo nor Zeus are not pro.
While Amades/Ralph are.
About Oni, He is not as good as them.
Back 2 years ago Amadeus almost beated Boss who was Japan #1 climbing up to the tower of pros. So no.
Yet, lately I found it very hard to say who is stronger that who!
Specially around G5 (-1).
They are all great. For ex:
I can tell you Mares is better than Bismarck or vice versa.
Anyway, we 3 matches ahead and it's hard to tell if Ryoma puts and end to it or Medanore?

I mean technically Ralph and QP are not pro in paper. But definitely pro level