Chapter Tower of God Chapter 603 Spoilers & Discussion

[Shiinhye1]

merry christmas turtles Enjoy it

https://comick.cc/comic/02-tower-of-god/0GI7NJa0-chapter-603-en

 

[Demonspeed]

Cosmic-Scans version.

 

[King Dryst]

Traumerei on the other hand has done real harm to Baam and his friends.

What harm? He hasn't actually succeeded in doing much of anything to anybody, and hasn't even tried very hard to. He's a shitty father, but that's not really anything related to Baam and company. I guess you could argue for Elaine, but I think that was more Elbaba than Traumerei. And obviously Yama, however much Baam considers him a friend.

Come on, this isn't even true. He used Rachel as a stalking horse for his own ends, he never intended or even thought that she could ever manage to steal Enkidu for herself.

Even beyond Enkidu there's also the issue of the bracelet that Zahard's data entrusted to Baam, and that Gustang took and then gave to Rachel. Whatever he might have done in the past, it seems he's made his choice of who he wants to support now and it isn't Baam. Anybody who provides shelter, aid and comfort to her is not a friend or ally to Baam.

 

[Epic_Rider]

What harm? He hasn't actually succeeded in doing much of anything to anybody, and hasn't even tried very hard to. He's a shitty father, but that's not really anything related to Baam and company. I guess you could argue for Elaine, but I think that was more Elbaba than Traumerei. And obviously Yama, however much Baam considers him a friend.

Kidnapping Baam and holding his friends hostage to get him to do stuff is indeed harming him.

Even beyond Enkidu there's also the issue of the bracelet that Zahard's data entrusted to Baam, and that Gustang took and then gave to Rachel. Whatever he might have done in the past, it seems he's made his choice of who he wants to support now and it isn't Baam. Anybody who provides shelter, aid and comfort to her is not a friend or ally to Baam.

We don't even know if that is the real thing or a copy. At the very least, he didn't give it to her to help her in her goals but his own. The fact that Rachel has deluded herself into thinking she's running this war is proof enough that he's isn't really aiding her in anything.

 

[paulbee]

Bam's greatest enemy is King Jahad, and unfortunately Traumeiri is Completely Jahad's dog, so whatever else may happen (considering Bam's likely future mission), Traumeiri is not and probably never will work in concert with Bam. He is willing to use Bam though.

While Gustang is not beyond using Bam, it does seem that Gustang's long term goals are aligned with Bam, and they may in fact need each other, or I should say rather thatGustang's rebelion is a plus for Bam, and I don't see him returning to Zahard's Camp easily. Zahard who has imprisoned his daughter for a long time.

As for Gustang's dealings with Rachel, it seems obvious to me that he is merely using her, so unless SIU does something totally unexpected, I can't see him returning to Zahard's camp easily. For that to happen Zahard will have to release Gustang's daughter and even if he does, I don't think Gustang will easily let bygones be bygones and forgive Zahard.

I feel that the relationship between Zahard and Gustang are too far broken to be mended. I also don't see Traumeiri and Bam forming any kind of relationship because even if he tolerates Bam, Traumeiri will never recant his disdain for Bam's friends who are Tower born and Insignificant in Traumeiri's eyes. From Bam's viewpoint it seems to me that Traumeiri attitude toward Towerborn is simply not accepible.

 

[Demonspeed]

Bam's greatest enemy is King Jahad, and unfortunately Traumeiri is Completely Jahad's dog, so whatever else may happen (considering Bam's likely future mission), Traumeiri is not and probably never will work in concert with Bam. He is willing to use Bam though.

While Gustang is not beyond using Bam, it does seem that Gustang's long term goals are aligned with Bam, and they may in fact need each other, or I should say rather thatGustang's rebelion is a plus for Bam, and I don't see him returning to Zahard's Camp easily. Zahard who has imprisoned his daughter for a long time.

As for Gustang's dealings with Rachel, it seems obvious to me that he is merely using her, so unless SIU does something totally unexpected, I can't see him returning to Zahard's camp easily. For that to happen Zahard will have to release Gustang's daughter and even if he does, I don't think Gustang will easily let bygones be bygones and forgive Zahard.

I feel that the relationship between Zahard and Gustang are too far broken to be mended. I also don't see Traumeiri and Bam forming any kind of relationship because even if he tolerates Bam, Traumeiri will never recant his disdain for Bam's friends who are Tower born and Insignificant in Traumeiri's eyes. From Bam's viewpoint it seems to me that Traumeiri attitude toward Towerborn is simply not accepible.

Baam's "duty" to kill Zahard is something that's been forced upon him. Jinsung himself said it. He has never even seen the guy and he didn't know his parents.

He only has curiosity. He doesn't have to kill him just because they said so.

He is an enemy because he is a threat to his friends but it's not that serious between them.

 

[King Dryst]

He is an enemy because he is a threat to his friends but it's not that serious between them.

Well, that and the whole asphyxiation fetish that Zahard seems to have towards him.

 

[kkck]

Gustang is the one helping Rachel in her latest attempt to steal things that are supposed to be Baam's (this is a place where he is meant to go, and Enkidu is sealed there). Until this chapter it was still a remote possibility that she was just doing things behind his back while he was preoccupied with the war, but now we know he was behind the attempt. The fact that he's even keeping her at all makes him an obvious enemy to Baam.

Nevermind the whole 'destroy everything in the Tower' bit that Baam gleaned from the book's preface, and is a much bigger issue than whatever smaller scale issues he might have with Traumerei.

Note I didn't say gustang wasn't an enemy to bam, rather than he isn't more of an enemy to bam than traumerei. Gustang is certainly backing rachel though I wouldn't necessarily say this makes him more or less an enemy to bam nor does it evidence more or less animosity for bam on his end. Of course it's likely that over time things could change and gustang could end up being the bigger enemy or threat to bam. But as of right now traumerie wants to essentially enslave bam while gustang has dumas pursuing him to recover his memories.

 

[lemo]

Man the hype up being that apparently killed 2 FHs friend can't killed 2 pretty weak regulars man SIU.

Also on that same note I don't like Rachel but what's the point of constantly bringing her back if all she does is fail miserably at whatever she does? Like what are we trying to achieve here with her?

One could say she's succeeding at ruining expectations... Among other things

 

[kkck]

Baam's "duty" to kill Zahard is something that's been forced upon him. Jinsung himself said it. He has never even seen the guy and he didn't know his parents.

He only has curiosity. He doesn't have to kill him just because they said so.

He is an enemy because he is a threat to his friends but it's not that serious between them.

To me this is at a weird point in the story. Bam is not out on some vendetta against zahard but zahard did try to choke the life out of him at the hidden floor. So this could be more personal on bam's end. At this point bam will likely pursue zahard simply because zahard wouldn't relent on killing him or his friends.

--- Double Post Merged, Dec 28, 2023, Original Post Date: Dec 28, 2023 ---

One could say she's succeeding at ruining expectations... Among other things

In fairness, this is probably one of the few times in the story where rachel has tried to do stuff on her own or even shown any confidence. And hwa ryun did confirm rachel has the qualifications, she just wasn't ready for this. Which is understandable if this is something bam was supposed to find soonish and perhaps accomplish. This at a point where in his base he seems to be in the ballpark of above average high rankers and at his full power would be about comparable to white level high rankers. Rachel has without a doubt changed, we just don't have the context of it.

 

[King Dryst]

Gustang is certainly backing rachel though I wouldn't necessarily say this makes him more or less an enemy to bam nor does it evidence more or less animosity for bam on his end.

As far as I'm concerned the two things are completely mutually exclusive. Rachel has made little secret about her desire to steal Baam's place and leave him as a meaningless nobody. That sabotage is what Gustang is abetting by keeping and aiding her, and he is actively doing so by arranging her access to a place Baam is meant to go and a powerup he is meant to have.

So...yeah. Fuck that dude. Not too pleased with Hwa Ryun for her role in this either, even if her arm was twisted a bit.

 

[kkck]

As far as I'm concerned the two things are completely mutually exclusive. Rachel has made little secret about her desire to steal Baam's place and leave him as a meaningless nobody. That's what Gustang is abetting by keeping and aiding her, and he is actively doing so by arranging her access to a place Baam is meant to go and a powerup he is meant to have.

So...yeah. Fuck that dude.

There's a lot of assumptions over stuff we simply don't know about. Has rachel even told gustang what her personal objectives are in regards to bam? Even if she did, is this something gustang would care about? Gustang's grander objective at this point seems to be the indiscriminate murder of the great warriors and their families (including his own). Outside of that I don't get the impression gustang has much of a stake in how rachel or bam develop, he is going to fuck up the tower and leave the rest to them. And again, I am not saying that gustang isn't bam's enemy. He just isn't more of an enemy than traumerei who is aligned with zahard and wants to basically enslave bam to fight the incoming war and overcome his enemies.

 

[King Dryst]

There's a lot of assumptions over stuff we simply don't know about. Has rachel even told gustang what her personal objectives are in regards to bam? Even if she did, is this something gustang would care about? Gustang's grander objective at this point seems to be the indiscriminate murder of the great warriors and their families (including his own). Outside of that I don't get the impression gustang has much of a stake in how rachel or bam develop, he is going to fuck up the tower and leave the rest to them. And again, I am not saying that gustang isn't bam's enemy. He just isn't more of an enemy than traumerei who is aligned with zahard and wants to basically enslave bam to fight the incoming war and overcome his enemies.

I don't really give a rat's ass about his motivations though. I care about what he's doing, not why he's doing it.

 

[kkck]

I don't really give a rat's ass about his motivations though. I care about what he's doing, not why he's doing it.

I mean, motivations are what gives context to the whole thing.

 

[King Dryst]

I mean, motivations are what gives context to the whole thing.

I don't need context to see that something is happening here that is potentially detrimental to Baam's prestige, and that Gustang's current actions are helping it to occur. Him being ignorant or apathetic wouldn't excuse any of it for me. He might have done good things in the past, but we're in the present. His descent into being a stinky douchebag coincided directly with his bringing Rachel into his sheepfold. Sleep with mangy dogs, wake up with fleas. You can spend years building a reputation and a minute ruining one. That's what's happened with this guy for me. Similar to Androssi, come to think of it. So easily and obviously avoidable, but he didn't manage it.

As for Traumerei, I'll care when something he does actively harms Baam's place in the narrative. Thus far he's only abetted Baam getting Leviathan by setting his trap at the Nest. And he's also put at least one girl in his orbit who would be a major upgrade to the horned shrew. He's been helpful, even if unintentionally so. From his chat with Kirin, he probably did it on purpose though. He might want to tie Baam down, but he's been so bad at it that it hardly matters. And even if he'd succeeded, Baam's new position would have been an improvement over whatever he has in FUG since they're still insultingly calling him a mere Slayer Candidate.

 

[paulbee]

Baam's "duty" to kill Zahard is something that's been forced upon him. Jinsung himself said it. He has never even seen the guy and he didn't know his parents.

He only has curiosity. He doesn't have to kill him just because they said so.

He is an enemy because he is a threat to his friends but it's not that serious between them.

A Very Excellent argument!

I salute your insightful analysis. You are pointing out that there is no hatred between Bam and Zahard and there need not be any either.

The question then is this, If Bam doesn't oppose Jahad in any way, will destiny permit co-existence between them. Rightaway Judging by Luslec being willing to fight Urek for access to Bam, it is likely that FUG will do their best to create enmity between Bam and Zahard.

Will Gustangs actions somehow lead to inexorable conflict between Bam and Zahard? Perhaps Zahard's biggest mistake will turn out to be him starting a war with the Po Bidau family

How will events lead to the anticipated and prophesied conflict between Bam andd Zahard? If SIU leaves things as they are (without Bam and Zahard becoming enemies) one wonders what kind of story TOG will become, and would still remain an exciting story that's worth reading?

 

[O_n_Sly]

Not sure why everyone gets soo caught up about lore and prophecy!!! The GWs rewrote history/factual accounts until we know when or what they changed the lore and prophecy mean shit!!!

 

[B.Nixus3]

I don't need context to see that something is happening here that is potentially detrimental to Baam's prestige, and that Gustang's current actions are helping it to occur. Him being ignorant or apathetic wouldn't excuse any of it for me. He might have done good things in the past, but we're in the present. His descent into being a stinky douchebag coincided directly with his bringing Rachel into his sheepfold. Sleep with mangy dogs, wake up with fleas. You can spend years building a reputation and a minute ruining one. That's what's happened with this guy for me. Similar to Androssi, come to think of it. So easily and obviously avoidable, but he didn't manage it.

The only reasons Gustang let Rachel into this situation was to show her that she wasn't worthy, to (potentially) discourage her from getting in the way of Baam, & to open the door to Enkidu. Previously, both at the entrance to the tower and on the hidden floor, Rachel complained that the only reason she wasn't as capable as Baam was because he had tools (the Black March at first, then the thorn fragments next). Now she has no excuse for her utter incompetence, though because of her "irregular" status, she can still "do things" Gustang cannot, & since Baam is not generally complicit (like using a key to open a door vs forcing a card into the space between the door & jamb to break in).

In either case, Gustang is trying to use an irregular to his own ends, but because Baam is less susceptible to manipulation from the FH & is a "wild card," Gustang is forced to break in to these places using Rachel. Remember from the previous chapter that the prized book told Gustang even he is not considered "worthy," so even with all his knowledge he isn't able to do certain things within the tower which require either the complicit Rachel or the unpredictable Baam.

As for Traumerei, I'll care when something he does actively harms Baam's place in the narrative. Thus far he's only abetted Baam getting Leviathan by setting his trap at the Nest. And he's also put at least one girl in his orbit who would be a major upgrade to the horned shrew. He's been helpful, even if unintentionally so. From his chat with Kirin, he probably did it on purpose though. He might want to tie Baam down, but he's been so bad at it that it hardly matters. And even if he'd succeeded, Baam's new position would have been an improvement over whatever he has in FUG since they're still insultingly calling him a mere Slayer Candidate.

Traumerei is actually the same, as both FH are trying to use Baam toward their own means. Gustang actually wants Baam to kill Jahad & open the 135th floor, neither of which Traumerei would assist Baam in, & Gustang provided Tiara to Baam, who is just as close to him as the twins (she even refused Dumas' order from Gustang). Gustang also inadvertently provided Baam with his most valued book, & as I've said before, at the end of the day, whether it's Gustang (& FUG) wanting Baam to "fulfill his destiny" or Traumerei wanting Baam to "join the FH ranks," neither reflects what Baam TRULY wants, which to this point is not specifically stated or known aside from keeping his friends & this he meets alive.

What IS known is that everywhere Baam goes, he brings chaos to what was previously considered "stable" by the higher ups of the tower. There is no more name hunt station, the floor of tests has forever been changed & the stand-in admin replaced, the wall of rebels has been opened, 2 of Jahad's army squadrons have been defeated, the hidden floor no longer exists, White was put back together (and subsequently taken apart), multiple princesses have openly rebelled against their purpose, the last station had it's status revoked, the workshop has been raided, regulars now believe they can (generally) beat rankers, the dogs are loose again, and the hidden secrets of the tower are beginning to come to light against the wishes of those in power. To put an end to the arguments of those telling SIU to "just let Baam keep climbing the tower without involving the FH," the FH (& FUG) are already losing their grasp on the tower by even "allowing" Baam to have made it THIS far, & Baam never moved according to any of their wishes. His "climbing the tower as a regular" is the equivalent of using a wrecking ball to do light interior decorating in a house.

 

[CountDookoe]

Not sure why everyone gets soo caught up about lore and prophecy!!! The GWs rewrote history/factual accounts until we know when or what they changed the lore and prophecy mean shit!!!

SIU makes the lore that's worldbuilding, prophecy's should not be a direct translation whats gonna happen. i like how george is doing it with GoT, i hope he finishes that story before it's too late, excellent worldbuilding. to get back to the point what i like about ToG is its GoTness. The deaths, betrayals, worldbuilding feeling like the story takes place in an actual world. the multiple perspectives also gave the feel of anyone can die which now with certain characters is ruined. but nothing is perfect and i think is SIU can make it plenty more entertaining and interesting with time. personally i'd like to see the story progress without necessarily following Baam constantly but certain aspects have to get wrapped up for that. i enjoy the story for what it is tho, its the only manga/manwha i still actually read and wait for a new chapter. props to SIU idk see anyone here doing it.

 

[paulbee]

Not sure why everyone gets soo caught up about lore and prophecy!!! The GWs rewrote history/factual accounts until we know when or what they changed the lore and prophecy mean shit!!!

Well since you asked, the reason is simple. It's like in One Piece, I followed One Piece because I wanted to find out what the One Piece is and I wanted to see how the little boy Luffy become king of the pirates and defeat the World Government against all odds. Thankfully Oda seems to be sticking to his promise even after decades of writting.

Likewise, We decided to read and have followed this Manwah for years based on the Theme the author promised. On the contrary, I used to follow My Hero accademia because I liked the character and portrayial of All Might, powerful, optimistic, dependable. I expected the same feel for All Might's successor. How ever the story has changed too dramatically. It feels like a totally different comic now, so I lost interest and dropped it.

I would feel cheated, and I would feel I wated my time if the Theme, The Thesis of TOG that was set at the begining of the tale was never fulfilled, and the expected ending promised at the begining was changed too much.

If SIU never intended for Bam to faced down and defeat a Tyranical king (Jahad), to avenge the wrong done to his family was not carried forward, I would feel like he played a fast and lose bait and switch game. I might still like it, but I would forever be let down and feel like I was being jerked aound after years of anticipation.

 

[Kiibou]

I realized Enkidou is basically the White Oars to Traumerei. Both of them were gifted by the Great Teacher.

i wonder if every Family Head received something like this.

 

[insignificant creature]

I realized Enkidou is basically the White Oars to Traumerei. Both of them were gifted by the Great Teacher.

i wonder if every Family Head received something like this.

Gustang received his mothership and Jahad too received lelacius