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Books A Song of Ice and Fire (Original Book Series) [SPOILERS - BEWARE]

Notice me Escanor senpai

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Yeah, he used to write an episode himself a season, but stopped after season 4 iirc.


I don't remember if there were any specifics involved, but it was someone on the practical effects team who mentioned something like that last season or something. That a particular sequence kept getting pushed back because they didn't know how to pull it off. Most people immediately thought this was LSH, but Melisandre's "reveal" earlier this season is also a potential candidate now.

Yeah, bringing Benjen back and showing that they're getting back to more "book plot" in the Riverlands makes me believe that there's an outside chance of it happening.
It doesn't even need to be Michelle Fairley actually, but there's nothing on her filmography after a quick look that leads to me believe that there would be any sort of scheduling conflict to prevent her from coming back.
Yes that's what I read, well in any case if they plan to include her then it fits, since they're bringing all the book stuff with Jaime going to the Riverlands. I also read some casting info about the actor who plays Thoros of Myr returning to this season, but it's just a rumour.
Oh and the brotherhood is mentioned in episode 6, the Freys got attacked by them. Foreshadowing?
There has been no news about Michelle Fairley shooting something for this season, and I guess they don't really need her to play LSH since her face is all messed up.So it's mostly make up and effects.
 

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Oh and the brotherhood is mentioned in episode 6, the Freys got attacked by them. Foreshadowing?
There has been no news about Michelle Fairley shooting something for this season, and I guess they don't really need her to play LSH since her face is all messed up.So it's mostly make up and effects.
Yeah, he could easily turn up again, without Richard Dormer though...which could only mean something like LSH IMO
I imagine that her scene could have been something shot on a set, decreasing the chances of her being spotted. Plus, there wouldn't be the same amount of scrutiny, the filming sessions were nothing but a quest to spot Kit Harrington, after all.
 

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Ah - ASOIAF, I really need to catch up with the books. (I got half-way into Feast and then stopped).

I've been trying to slow out my reading so my mind is still fresh/up to date when GRRM finally releases the next installment.
 

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I tried my first reread a while ago and basically finished GoT and then the World book came out, read all of that, then the Dunk and Egg compilation came out...and then I just forgot about it. I always get an urge whenever hype around the show starts back up, but I'm really going to do it when this season ends.
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Ah - ASOIAF, I really need to catch up with the books. (I got half-way into Feast and then stopped).

I've been trying to slow out my reading so my mind is still fresh/up to date when GRRM finally releases the next installment.
Did you stop reading due to Feast, or other things? I personally think it's the most underrated book in the series. Some of GRRM's most beautifully written stuff is in that book.
 

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The problem with Feast is the regional division, I read it missing the north so badly.. that being said, Cersey chapters are gold
It's so great to see her drunk ass taking bad decision after bad decision and thinking "Oh father, can you see how smart I am, how I solved this, how I'm much better than any of your male sons".. it was great man, especially since up til this point she had been a player on the game
 

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It's biggest issue is the regional divide, yeah. A lot of people were wanting to hear what went on with Jon, Dany, Tyrion, and instead got a whole bunch of new PoVs instead. Storm of Swords culminated in a ton of crazy shit, Feast was all about the aftermath...all great dramas have peaks and valleys.
 

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There are a few alternate reading orders for book 4 & 5 that combine them. Even if it's your first read through, there really isn't much reason not to, as long as you know when to stop in 5, is there?
 

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Did you stop reading due to Feast, or other things? I personally think it's the most underrated book in the series. Some of GRRM's most beautifully written stuff is in that book.
Life got in the way primarily. Though I will admit that I found Feast a bit dry (at least compared to the first three books). That was likely the reason I didn't make time to get through it.

There are a few alternate reading orders for book 4 & 5 that combine them. Even if it's your first read through, there really isn't much reason not to, as long as you know when to stop in 5, is there?
I'd heard that. Or at least heard that Feast and Dance were originally one giant book.

Do you know where I could get that reading order/list? That might help keep my interest when I go back to the series.
 

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Do you know where I could get that reading order/list? That might help keep my interest when I go back to the series.
It's a project called A Ball of Beasts
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If the novels were reordered in that way at some point and time I'd definitely consider purchasing it, but the idea of skipping around and having to go back and forth between books is an obstacle for me doing that...but I might attempt it on my next reread.
 

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There's also an attempt to achieve that on boiledleather one of many actually, but this seems to be refined for reading friendliness. They don't fuse chapters or anything fancy. But then it's not fully chronological either due to some revelations. There may be a place to weave in the shortstories as well.
 

Kato756

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And as always, it looks like I am the sole Feast lover (excluding arya chapters).

Have you guys read all the released Winds of Winter chapters?
(As far as I know there are 3)
 

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I think so, but there should be 7 released in some written form by now. Roughly 1/10th to 1/11th of the book, going by the previous books chapter counts. Plus a few more read at conventions. Not waiting for the whole thing anymore though. One day it'll be there.
 

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No, I think Feast gets shit on way too much by fans. I loved it.
It has tyrion and the iron islands, what else can we ask of it right?
 

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Just started re reading these after falling out of love with them a few years ago... many of the problems I had with them back then I still sorely feel now. I think the primary one is just how bad GRRM has been at producing a concise story... there's still loads of stuff that should have been left on the cutting room floor to my mind but which ended up making it in. I mean ASOS and ADWD are both almost as long as the entire Lord of the Rings Trilogy - which is insanity, it's got to be one of if not the most unfocused work to ever get published. Knowing what to leave out is almost as important as the stuff that goes in, JRRT had pages and pages of notes and extra material that stayed as just that, at best appearing at the end appendices, Martin just doesn't seem to get that all the superfluous waffle that at best is passingly interesting world building really detract from the readability of the series.

I mean don't get me wrong, it's a great story, with some of the most vibrant characters out there, but to be honest someone a bit more ruthless needed to go through it and create an 'abridged' version - which is why overall I think this is possibly the single example of where I think the film (or actually TV series in this case) manages to be better than the novels it's based on...
 

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I think this is possibly the single example of where I think the film (or actually TV series in this case) manages to be better than the novels it's based on
Couldn't disagree more. I can understand people who aren't huge fans of GRRM's style of prose or whatever, but the later books, Crows and Dance have some of the most beautifully written passages he's ever written. Unsure about superfluousness honestly. If you weren't into expansive world-building in a fantasy world with political intrigue, I sort of question what drew you to the series in the first place. GRRM also left out mountains of detail out of the novels, hence the companion pieces he's put out (Dunk & Egg, The Princess and the Queen, The Rogue Prince, TWOIAF, TLOIAF). as well as plenty he's yet to release.

The show for the last 2/3 seasons or so hasn't really been the same story as the books. So I'm not sure how you can say it's the single example where the series is better than the novels. Especially if you're familiar with the material the show was supposed to be adapting during this time in the story. It's not really an apples to apples comparison anymore to me. The writing quality has taken a complete nosedive IMO.
 

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Couldn't disagree more. I can understand people who aren't huge fans of GRRM's style of prose or whatever, but the later books, Crows and Dance have some of the most beautifully written passages he's ever written. Unsure about superfluousness honestly. If you weren't into expansive world-building in a fantasy world with political intrigue, I sort of question what drew you to the series in the first place. GRRM also left out mountains of detail out of the novels, hence the companion pieces he's put out (Dunk & Egg, The Princess and the Queen, The Rogue Prince, TWOIAF, TLOIAF). as well as plenty he's yet to release.

The show for the last 2/3 seasons or so hasn't really been the same story as the books. So I'm not sure how you can say it's the single example where the series is better than the novels. Especially if you're familiar with the material the show was supposed to be adapting during this time in the story. It's not really an apples to apples comparison anymore to me. The writing quality has taken a complete nosedive IMO.
TBH I don't have any problems with his prose, it's no masterpiece, but it does the job perfectly fine and probably fits the style of the story being told better than some ultra-polished wording. And I'm saying this only being mid CoK, when I left off before I was near the start of ASoS.

It's not that I'm not into the story, not at all, it's that I want the core story to go forward at an acceptable rate, not meander along getting distracted by extremely long winded non-core story threads... tbh he could literally rip out bleeding all of Bran's stuff after the first book and it wouldn't be missed, ditto Theon's betrayal etc etc... is it passingly interesting, sure, is it necessary for the telling of the story he's trying to tell? No. Does it hold back what should be building momentum up towards the serious conflicts at the story's climax? I'd argue yes.

What I'm really talking about is streamlining the story to just cover the core story he's trying to tell a little more - the squabble over the Throne weakening Westeros to the threat it should be preparing for from the North. The first book gets off to a good start all things considered, but then it just feels like all the momentum is taken out of the story from two onwards and we crawl along an extremely meandering path, getting that trademark unpredictability from the fact there's really no structure to the story, it's kind of hijacked historical events jumbled together into a sort of extremely unfocused storyline.

When I say JRRT left unneccesary things out, I'm talking like the whole White Council vs The Necromancer in The Hobbit, which of course has literally nothing to do with the story being told of trying to reclaim Erebor from Smaug. He also left out The battles at Dol Guldur and Dale from LotR as they weren't relevant to the story of the fellowship's journey. My argument is Martin includes this sort of thing and more, rather than trimming it down to what he should be writing about.

Well as I say I've never read beyond the start of Swords, so perhaps my opinion will change... if I actually get that far this time. But I feel that the TV series offers the same material in a more digestible format as it doesn't take so long to wade through it all.

Overall I think the book is like a precious metal ore, a good story is in there, but it's mixed up with stuff that detracts from it and would be made better if he re-focused on the core storyline rather than wandering off into expanding other far flung parts of the world. Having an incredibly detailed world is all well and good, but there's a limit to how much of it can be included before it starts suffocating the action of the story imo.
 

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Well as I say I've never read beyond the start of Swords, so perhaps my opinion will change... if I actually get that far this time. But I feel that the TV series offers the same material in a more digestible format as it doesn't take so long to wade through it all.
I mean, not to sound too patronizing, but I think not even reading halfway through the series and then claiming that the show is better is rather silly. Clash is often regarded as a transitional novel. It was about setting a larger table for how expansive the story gets. So, I'd recommend at least finishing Storm before making too many conclusions. That being said, if you know what's coming due to following the show's story, then it could be that the novel's impact is lessened, but I'm not sure whether that sort of thing bothers you much or not.

The show is more digestible in that it's not hundreds of pages long, lacks a huge portion of detail/background and nuance. If you weren't into the novels earlier and that sort of thing is too cumbersome to you, then preferring the show makes sense on some level. I however couldn't care less about length because I never really found myself uninterested in what I was reading. That doesn't mean I don't prefer some storylines in the book over others.

I had read the original novel 10 years or so before discovering the show. After a few episodes I realized that the story was familiar and that I had read it. After the first season ended I gobbled up all the novels and luckily a month or so later Dance came out. Does this mean my perspective on the novels are different? Sure, even though SOME things were accidentally spoiled for me, but that kind of thing doesn't necessarily ruin something for me. Even after this, seasons 2 through 4 lacked only some disappointment, such as the Qarth storyline being heavily and needlessly altered in the show. (this ended up being compounded as the Rhaegar storyline was reintroduced). But I'd say that the show from Season 5 on is rather inferior to the books in almost every way imaginable. There's still some bright spots here and there, and by no means is the show terrible on the whole or anything. It's just disappointing from a book reader's perspective.
 
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